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New Warren Out.
Elizabeth Warren’s expected withdrawal from the presidential primary leaves only three candidates in the race: Joe Biden, Bernie Sanders and Tulsi Gabbard.

Considering Gabbard has only won one delegate so far, this is effectively a two-candidate race between Biden and Sanders.

The next test for Biden and Sanders will come on Tuesday, when six states will hold primaries.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2020/mar/05/elizabeth-warren-donald-trump-bernie-sanders-joe-biden-live-updates

If she endorses Biden over Bernie, I hope she loses her Senate seat.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New Of course she will endorse Bernnie
Surely, by now, the Russians have told her she must.
New Indeed! Why not endorse the candidate who is guaranteed to lose!
Sanders == Corbyn

1. Super-popular with party
2. Electoral dogshit at the ballot box
3. Given to expressing surprise at (2) given that (1) happened, apparently not cognisant of the fact that party != electorate
4. Quest for ideological purity ensures ongoing power for the other guy
New You got it!
Alex

"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."

-- Isaac Asimov
New Biden has no chance. We'll have Trump for 4 more years.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New I'm not sure of your point.
If Biden's chance of defeating Trump is zero, then Sanders' is surely negative.
New Biden won *The South* FFS.
And do you really think *any* Democratic candidate will carry The South in November?

If our form of government is to survive, we must, MUST provide some reason for the 45+% of eligible voters who do not vote in our Presidential elections to show up and vote. This 45+% has no reason to support a RWNJ nor a "Moderate* Democrat."

Contrary to our mythology, we've always been a plutocracy. From the slave holding Land Barons who founded the nation to the destruction of the "New Deal" Democratic Party brought about by one Bill Clinton. I find myself in agreement with Paul Krugman who admonishes Sanders for using the word "Socialist." There's nothing Socialist in what Bernie's advocating. Franklin D. Roosevelt would have supported (or co-authored) Bernie's platform. His "Medicare for All" pitch could have been written by the authors of the original designers of Medicare. Several years ago the last living member of that committee even said as much, noting that after the elderly, the plan was to extend benefits to under-18's. Then over 50's at which point, he said, there'd be so few not covered the last group (19-49) would be easy to add. All of Bernie's policies are the type of policies that were very much mainstream in the Pre-Clinton Democratic Party. And that is in no small measure why they are so popular. If you look at the results of exit polling in the states that Biden won, the number one issue for over half of Biden's voters was "Medicare for All" despite the person they voted for opposing it.

As far as Bernie being Corbyn, perhaps you can tell me, Peter, how "radical" an idea would it be for a British politician to claim s/he "supported the NHS"?




* "Moderate" here is in the American sense. A Right-Center Tory. One sufficiently Right that s/he wouldn't support the NHS. A Nigel Farage, in essence. That's a "Moderate" here.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New Everyone supports the NHS over here
Because not to do so is political suicide.

But here != there.

As noted by some American analyst on Radio 4 this morning, the election in November is really all about 80,000 swing voters in 5 states.

Sanders is toxic to sufficient swing voters that he cannot win. Biden is likely toxic to Sanders voters (and herewith half the fuckin' problem; there's nowt the Left (relative or otherwise) enjoys more than shouting "splitters!" at people whose goals largely align with their own), but can attract the floaters.

The other problem, of course, is that even if I'm dead wrong, and on paper Sanders can win, his victory is predicated on The Youth.

And The Youth will blow off voting for all sorts of reasons, including slightly inclement weather, something good on TV, shiny objects, and nothing at all. The Old vote no matter what, come hell or high water.

Aside:
Also note that Corbyn built a solid foundation of activism over his 33 years in parliament; whilst almost certainly well-intentioned, he did thing after thing after thing that made him look like he was aligned with if not actually sympathetic to our enemies and antagonists. A classic case was him going to Dublin to "negotiate" with Sinn Fein, back when SF were yet to be legitimate in the eyes of the UK government; what the fuck did he think he was doing? He had literally no mandate; he was just some bloke, and he ended up coming off, as always did, as being in bed with the enemies of the UK. At the very best he's always looked thoroughly unpatriotic.

AFAIK, Sanders has never done this. So there's that.
New It's difficult to argue with that.
Particularly this bit...
But here != there.

Understood. BUT how are we ever going to improve here (the US) to the point that we get close to there (the UK) if we keep electing people beholding to the bankster class?

I think I was first, here, to voice concern that if Bernie is the nominee, we run the danger of a McGovern replay. Still, if we are ever to improve our lot, isn't it absolutely necessary that we continue to try? Perhaps not. Perhaps it is time to call in the boats and piss on the Admiral. That is a bitter pill to swallow for anyone who has children and has, unlike the overwhelming majority of his fellow Americans, had the privilege of travelling to far more advanced societies across the Atlantic.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New Re: It's difficult to argue with that.
Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the slightly less crappy, is all I can say.

Because "slightly less crappy" is all that's - realistically - on offer.
Expand Edited by pwhysall March 9, 2020, 03:12:55 PM EDT
New But not difficult to argue with that.
I've grown increasingly weary of the "don't let the perfect be the enemy ..." nonsense. I'm not talking about anywhere near perfect. I'm talking about, God help me, returning to the more just years of Reagan's 1980's. I cannot accept that such is too much to ask and I reject outright the notion that those days were "perfect."

Still, I think it's over for Bernie. All the establishment Democrats (read: New Way, Republican Democrats) are lining up behind the Plagiarist Senator from MBNA and it's only a matter of time before he's the nominee. More is the pity. But, as you say, it's the best we can do. I can think of no greater indictment of our system and our people than that to close upon.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
Expand Edited by mmoffitt March 9, 2020, 03:42:07 PM EDT
New Voters in primaries != voters in election.
Besides, even in primaries, let's see what happens in Michigan next Tuesday.
Alex

"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."

-- Isaac Asimov
New Michigan decided that Biden has the best chance to beat Trump.
Piss on the policies. That's secondary. Presidents never get their way.

Biden won every county!
Alex

"There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."

-- Isaac Asimov
New If you run a Republican against a Republican, a Republican will win every time.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New And if you run a Democrat against a Republican but "progressives" won't vote for him...?
The concept of "only have themselves to blame" seems to be totally lost on them. Including you.
--

   Christian R. Conrad
The Man Who (used to think he) Knows Fucking Everything


Mail: Same username as at the top left of this post, at iki.fi
New The Progressives aren't the problem
Haven't heard anyone say yet they will not turn out because Sanders lost/failed/was done in/run over/... (FYI, I'm in Vermont)

I doubt Biden can dislodge those who voted facist because of the promise to get their job back. Biden's promised "More of the same" is what got them disillusioned to begin with. At best, they'll stay home, at worst they'll stick with Trump because they believe he'll yet deliver.

Either way, it looks doubtful things will not improve in real terms.
New Perhaps I was too subtle.
I, like the vast majority of Sanders backers, *will* vote for the Plagiarist Senator from MBNA if he is the Democratic nominee. If he wins the general election, we'll have a sane traditional Republican in the White House who will slow down or completely stop the majority, but not all, of the worst Republican policies. If he loses, we'll have an insane semi-traditional Republican in the White House and can expect an intensification of the worst Republican policies, which will bring us ever closer to becoming a true fascist state.

Either way, we'll have a Republican in the White House. See?
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New No, you weren't. But you're far too fucking cock-sure of yourself.
First, for assuming anything you can write would escape my comprehension. I really don't know, nor think, you can be that "subtle". Haven't seen any signs of it so far, but feel free to start any time.

Second, for promising for all Progressivedom that they won't actually, by staying home in Glorious Protest, vote for Trump. Totally missed the last few rounds of Democratic primary elections, did you? The ones where The Youngs all voted for Bernie... well, not in the actual primaries -- because if they had, they wouldn't have been such landslides for Biden -- but only on Twitter.
--

   Christian R. Conrad
The Man Who (used to think he) Knows Fucking Everything


Mail: Same username as at the top left of this post, at iki.fi
New Seen elsewhere, anent the Sanders campaign:
“A principal reason the Revolution is called the Revolution is that no one is very eager to vote for it. Otherwise it would be called the Election.”

(for the rest, I don’t see an upside for Warren in endorsing anyone just now. And although I’ll vote unhesitatingly for Sanders in November should he be the nominee, I think his presidency would be a hot mess)

cordially,
New Re: Warren Out.
In an interview yesterday called out Sanders for his supporters’ organized nastiness, and said that he should not be the nominee. I’m perfectly fine with her remaining Massachusetts Senator.

I suspect we may be seeing another principled abstention in mmoffitt’s future…

cordially,
New I don't think I'll sit it out.
Of course, I might not live until November in which case I clearly won't be taking part in the charade this November. I've said before that I would hold my nose and vote for the Senator from MBNA if he got the nomination.

But I will say this. If I had any extra money, I'd start buying stock in Wellpoint, Cigna, Goldman-Sachs, etc. sic nauseum right now because those will be the only true winners in November whether its the Orange Menace or the Democrat's version of Alzheimer's Reagan.

Also of note, the spousette registered to vote and voted for the first time in her life for Bernie in the primary in 2016. She won't be going to the polls for Biden however, and I had absolutely nothing to do with that. It won't matter anyway. Trump will win Indiana by at least 500,000 votes. As he did last time when Democrats also ran a Republican. Bernie would likely lose Indiana as well, but I'd wager by a smaller margin. But in that case at least I'd be able to feel good about casting my vote, instead of vomiting immediately after casting it.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New out of curiosity
Why did the missus not vote prior to 2016? I know that the Kewl Kidz like to say that “if voting could actually change things it would be illegal,” but it’s difficult to understand in that case why the GOP has long striven to make it difficult. Also, the 2016 vote manifestly did change things. Were the spousette’s past abstentions grounded in her serene assurance that all was well in the polity without her participation?

cordially,

(Just so we’re clear: Biden was not my first or even fourth choice as the horses cleared the gates last year, but for reasons of temperament, Sanders was also well back in the field.)
New why people vote or not
I know someone who voted for one party religiously for many years because her brother voted religiously for many years for the other party just to nullify his vote. Folks are notional
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
New A variation in C#-Minor re this: an early start on culling voters--on steroids:
via this: PILF-ering group

[Repo-grade old-white-guy-humor..?] Humor in a Repo...? And it's only MARCH. 'Course too, should above get to the USSC-branch-of-GOP: cf. other post de moi re the book, Supreme Inequality 'The Supreme Court's Fifty-Year Battle for an Unjust America'.

Do I smell a convergence--these are just Starters--where shortly.. the ackshul Brown. Shirts. are passed-out to the Troopers/young and old-white-guys.. so as to permit regular marches through dem Places where: ya jes better-not Show Up ..on a certain Tuesday.

Are we not.. that little boy? with finger-in-the-dike, shouting! ..but nobody will listen to the tyke (and Vrrroom--> Holland is submerged.)



Damn! another run.. on copies of Spike Jones' immortal In Der Führer's Face ..I just may still have that 78-shellac artifact in basement, know the words ..by now.
(Along with a dub of Maynard Ferguson's All the Things You Are--the original recalled by Mrs. Jerome Kern, who didn't LIke anyone who could slur well beyond High-C).
New She's reconsidered.
When I asked explicitly if she would vote for Biden in November she sighed and said, "I suppose I'll have to. It won't make any difference here though." So, she'll perhaps end up voting in her second Presidential election next Fall.

With regard to 2016 being her first, my sense is that she was singularly disinterested in politics until then. She is a clinician and has seen firsthand the horrors of our current medical delivery system for decades. Bernie's push for Medicare for All (along with her adult daughters pushing her) is what finally drew her out. Like most of her fellow physicians and Nurse Practitioners who aren't in it strictly for the boats, ski trips and country club memberships, she's long recognized that the only sane healthcare delivery system involves a national program, with, optionally, supplemental private insurance for things like breast augmentations, face lifts, botox injections and so forth.

Also, too, we were fortunate enough to be able to pay out of pocket for our two daughters undergraduate educations and were astounded at that expense, despite both of them attending state universities (albeit one out of state). The total we spent was upwards of $200,000. I believe that experience, too, coupled with Bernie's call for tuition-free state colleges and universities induced her to vote. Her first medically related degree was an Associates in Applied Science in Nursing; sufficient for her to become a board certified licensed Register Nurse (an R.N.). The total cost of tuition for her to earn that R.N. in two years? $72.00. Her Bachelor's in Nursing subsequent to that cost an additional $1,760.

There's an old adage that parents want better for their children. She and I want at least as much for our children as we had. Bernie is and was the only candidate arguing for policies that would allow the spousette and me to achieve our desire for our kids. I think that, more than anything else, is why she finally decided to vote.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
Expand Edited by mmoffitt March 9, 2020, 03:45:32 PM EDT
Expand Edited by mmoffitt March 9, 2020, 03:46:22 PM EDT
New I can call the spirits from the vasty deep!
“Why, so can I, or so can any man; but will they come, when you do call for them?”

coupled with Bernie's call for tuition-free state colleges and universities
An admirable goal, but has he ever outlined how, by presidential fiat or decree, he will bring this about? If he directs the University of California to henceforth charge no tuition*, the Regents will tell him to go pound sand. If he says “$14K for a year at Berkeley puts an education out of reach for many young people, so we will issue vouchers for that amount to any matriculating freshman,” the Regents will respond “Cool! Did we mention that next this fall’s tuition* is going up to $28K?”

I’ve previously mentioned the signs seen locally—presumably the work of an enthusiastic freelancer, and not the campaign itself—touting free healthcare, free tuition, forgiveness of student loan debt. Yay and woo to all, but by what magic, please, will President Sanders conjure these up? Were ideals and aspirations the sole deciding factors, I’d view candidate Sanders with a less jaundiced eye, but I’m also taking into account considerations of temperament (I don’t know how you regarded his post-convention performance in 2016, but I saw a cranky back-bencher extending a grudging, sour-spirited, decidedly pro forma support to his rival) and, frankly, electability. I think he would have been eviscerated four years ago, and might fare even worse this year. Certainly my own spouse’s predictions that the guy would turn out the Youngs in overwhelming numbers and coast to victory thereupon have not been borne out so far (the youth vote is down this year vs. 2016), but then again, though I love her dearly, L does not possess the level of granular political savvy that God gave a goose.

Uncle Joe warnt my first choice, but he’ll do in a pinch. President Sanders’ supporters will be disappointed when he fails to deliver utopia; President Biden’s supporters, to the extent that they imagine he will return us to “normalcy,” will also be let down: there’s no going back to the pre-Trump era. The country’s trajectory has been forever altered, and Trump may justly claim, if he lives to retirement, to have conducted a “transformative” presidency, rather in the sense that smallpox can be a transformative disease. We will bear the scars on our collective visage for a long time. So yes, Biden is an imperfect vessel, but I do not believe that he is an evil man, and a relatively benign, avuncular character will, I think, appeal to a broad swath of the populace exhausted by the antics of the barking mad despot presently in residence at the end of Pennsylvania Avenue. I doubt whether Sanders could achieve his grand goals; I have some confidence that Biden can provide a respite. And if we are serious about the kind of changes Sanders and Warren represent, the Democrats had damned well better shed the habit of letting the grass grow under their feet between elections, and should begin preparing for a new generation of political leadership for the rest of the decade.

About college expenses: I’ve probably related here how, owing to a miscommunication with the mothership, I arrived at college under the impression that I would be subsidized from home, whereas my old man apparently thought he’d made it clear that having fed, clothed and housed me for eighteen years, he’d done all that conscience required. This led to me going into significant arrears with the U of C, one of a cluster of reasons, including a deficit in academic performance, behind their decision to ask me to leave. Well, following a lengthy period in which I variously couch-surfed and was homeless outright, albeit discreetly, I talked my way back in, two years behind schedule, and until 1976 washed dishes on campus twenty hours a week, supplemented by summer jobs (canneries, car washes), and made it to graduation with about a hundred dollars to my name, and no debt, student or otherwise, whatsoever. This was not because I was particularly virtuous or thrifty, but because UC tuition* was about $1200 per annum in that era (an off-campus room could be had for between forty and seventy-five dollars a month), and between my dishwashing wages and a modest $50/month scholarship, I was able to cover my expenses.

Dishwashing wages at UC have not kept pace with tuition*, textbooks, lodging and related costs, they tell me. I would think it’s impossible for any freshman who finds himself in the position I did half a century ago could get through college without a crushing burden of debt. Good on you two for taking care of your daughters.

cordially,

*The University of California once prided itself on offering a free education to all academically-qualifying California students. Indeed, tuition was forbidden under the terms of the institution’s very charter. When Governor Reagan (spits), who had been elected on a platform clearly hinting at punitive measures to be visited upon “rioting students” and “permissive professors,” moved to impose “tuition,” this was pointed out to him. Nichto problemo: I don’t know whether the charter has ever been amended, but beginning in the latter sixties, UC, still tuition-free, began imposing “academic fees”: problem solved!
New GI bill is still available so there is a model to provide schooling for public service
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
New So, your message to following generations is, "I got mine. Too bad for you" then?
So, you'd classify the 1970's as an era of Utopia then? We *used* to make an education affordable, but hey, you and I are finished, so to suggest that subsequent generations should enjoy the same benefits we did is simply impossible and/or Utopian fantasy?

I've recently been thinking about this a bit. I've come to realize that the nut of the problem is that Republicans and like-minded Democrats (think Clinton and Obama - and likely the next Democratic Presidential nominee) are actually better for American Capitalism than anyone with a conscience. A Capitalist Society naturally polarizes wealth. It naturally trivializes the lives of anyone not in the Capitalist class. American Lefties say, "The system is broken." Senator Warren is a lot more honest when she says, "The system is rigged." Of course it is. The rigging is by design. It is part and parcel of any Capitalist system. The fact that the three wealthiest Americans possess more wealth than the bottom 50% of Americans isn't a design flaw - it is a realization of the predicted results. So, in one sense, I agree with you. Within a Capitalist system, each and every generation of non-Capitalist class people does far worse than the previous. That is how it is supposed to work and is what you can point to as proof of our inability to provide tuition-free educations at State colleges and Universities. We cannot do that because our Capitalist system has evolved beyond that stage.

I say we can do that, but only if we are willing to knee-cap the Capitalists.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New Most-all agreed ..in Calif. pre-Ronnie: it Was a Fiesta for *cheap* Edjumacacion.
(Even moi's Institute-fees were pocket-change, almost..) Then. But along came an über-Grifter and 'Proposition 13' on ballot: which greatly slashed TAXES paid on nascent *home-owners/buyers--it passed with Huzzah!!s from the MIddle-class enroute --> $$$Success. It's still Here. Etc. Free-money for the already-'insulated' with garish costumery to hide its real guts. Straight from the Reptile-brain.

* I cannot omit the fact that its timing allowed moi a just-under 4X ROI on selling a 3-story mini-Manse in the Kensington Hills.. some ~6 years later. Via such--and via my I Hate Shopping/it's Pavlov's dog all-over-again mien--I was able to create a lateral arabesque from my sinecure {sob: which I also 'Loved' daily) ... thence: Own my own time 24/7. (Well.. until whatever {Next -->?} brings upon us all.

(Methiks that Bernie's Reptile-offshoot: easy irascibility?, his temeperament) far ickier than Elizabeth's cool Fact-recounting ... is the main Tragedy of 'The Commons' writ large. Biden, should he iffily-squeak-in, just might wear himself out; pity that Biden/Warren is so not-apt to happen: it Could .. have cleared the way for Much. (Esp. if Biden simply opts out later, leaving the divine-smart term-filler I Wanted In. She Would be elected, and if B. drops in two years(?) ... Two Terms AND: Climate Awareness ever. fucking. Day.

Yeah.. Dream --> On; this is still a shit-hole banana 'republic', with garish grease-paint hiding its Picture of Dorian Gray decayed-interior to devastate anything in sight.

I want a pony.
New trying to clean the wrong end of the pool, go to the hershey bar side
https://campustechnology.com/articles/2017/08/09/research-whos-worth-more-the-administrator-or-the-professor.aspx
Should an average salary for full professors of $102,402 be considered low compared to an average salary of $334,617 for college and university presidents and $202,048 for chief financial officers? Should institutions be concerned that the ratio of faculty and staff positions per administrator dropped from 3.5 in 1990 to 2.2 in 2012? Those are the kinds of questions posed by a new report from the American Council of Trustees and Alumni (ACTA) that encourages college leaders to contain and even cut administrative spending.
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
New Re: So, your message to following generations is, "I got mine. Too bad for you" then?
I reread my post in order to see whether it could have lent itself to this interpretation. I suppose it could have, since you so construed it, but for the life of me I can’t see how.

cordially,
New It's muddy..
(Even) moi be Rich! ...compared with half the U.S. population unable to get together 4 C-Notes.
(More examples of how few can grok 'the exponential equation, emotionally'?)

Innit alll about one's environment? I be amidst those on the $$$-escalator, having moved in well before KW was discovered to be well away from ~'Cities?'. You are amidst the entire Gaussian, from impoverished-long-term, unto 'my every Wish may be gratified, in a trice'. Hmmm maybe neither of us fits into any demographic, other than for gossip purposes.
     Warren Out. - (mmoffitt) - (31)
         Of course she will endorse Bernnie - (Andrew Grygus)
         Indeed! Why not endorse the candidate who is guaranteed to lose! - (pwhysall) - (15)
             You got it! -NT - (a6l6e6x)
             Biden has no chance. We'll have Trump for 4 more years. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (13)
                 I'm not sure of your point. - (pwhysall) - (12)
                     Biden won *The South* FFS. - (mmoffitt) - (11)
                         Everyone supports the NHS over here - (pwhysall) - (3)
                             It's difficult to argue with that. - (mmoffitt) - (2)
                                 Re: It's difficult to argue with that. - (pwhysall) - (1)
                                     But not difficult to argue with that. - (mmoffitt)
                         Voters in primaries != voters in election. - (a6l6e6x) - (6)
                             Michigan decided that Biden has the best chance to beat Trump. - (a6l6e6x) - (5)
                                 If you run a Republican against a Republican, a Republican will win every time. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (4)
                                     And if you run a Democrat against a Republican but "progressives" won't vote for him...? - (CRConrad) - (3)
                                         The Progressives aren't the problem - (scoenye)
                                         Perhaps I was too subtle. - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                                             No, you weren't. But you're far too fucking cock-sure of yourself. - (CRConrad)
         Seen elsewhere, anent the Sanders campaign: - (rcareaga)
         Re: Warren Out. - (rcareaga) - (12)
             I don't think I'll sit it out. - (mmoffitt) - (11)
                 out of curiosity - (rcareaga) - (10)
                     why people vote or not - (boxley)
                     A variation in C#-Minor re this: an early start on culling voters--on steroids: - (Ashton)
                     She's reconsidered. - (mmoffitt) - (7)
                         I can call the spirits from the vasty deep! - (rcareaga) - (6)
                             GI bill is still available so there is a model to provide schooling for public service -NT - (boxley)
                             So, your message to following generations is, "I got mine. Too bad for you" then? - (mmoffitt) - (4)
                                 Most-all agreed ..in Calif. pre-Ronnie: it Was a Fiesta for *cheap* Edjumacacion. - (Ashton)
                                 trying to clean the wrong end of the pool, go to the hershey bar side - (boxley)
                                 Re: So, your message to following generations is, "I got mine. Too bad for you" then? - (rcareaga) - (1)
                                     It's muddy.. - (Ashton)

Eschew obfuscation.
282 ms