Incremental change has worked so well hasn't it?

Post #428,739 by mmoffitt 5/2/19 10:34:42 AM 5/2/19 10:34:42 AM Reply	Incremental change has worked so well hasn't it? I've got a lot more problem with him originally co-sponsoring the crappy legislation than I have with his finally coming back to his principles. Your source posts this exchange as (apparently) some sort of condemnation of Bernie. HAYES: “OK, so, you’re talking about ‘where we should go’, so I want to talk about that now. The Democrats introduced legislation in the House today that is focused on some reforms and modifications to Obamacare, particularly people who are in the exchanges who have very high premiums. Do you support the legislation the House produced today?” SANDERS: “No. I support the Medicare for All single payer program. Look...” HAYES: “Wait, so I just want to be clear...so you don’t support that incremental reform?” SANDERS: “No. The incremental reform that I support is phasing in Medicare for All. First year, we would lower the eligibility age for Medicare from 65 to 55 and cover all of the children, and by the way, expand Medicare coverage for elderly people to include dental care, eyeglasses and hearing aids. That’s the incremental 4-year program that I wrote and that I support.” HAYES: “Right...but I just want to be clear about this. So if that House bill were to come over to the Senate you would vote against it right now?” SANDERS: “Look...right now, it’s...right now we are working on what I have fought for my entire life. Healthcare is a right. It has to be publicly funded, it has to be comprehensive. http://acasignups.net/19/05/01/fun-fact-bernie-sanders-supported-aca-20until-3-weeks-ago But he's dead-bang right in that exchange. Continuing the Republican Healthcare Plan (aka The PPACA) is foolish when all the infrastructure is already present to incrementally implement MFA as is suggested and phase out the pro-profit PPACA that continues to leave 44 million people (about 1 in 8 of us) with no healthcare coverage at all. But, we're Muricans and incredibly stupid. So, we probably won't do it. bcnu, Mikem It's mourning in America again.
Post #428,741 by Another Scott 5/2/19 12:11:41 PM 5/2/19 12:11:41 PM Reply	Purity kills. Gaba keeps track of ACA uptake, etc. Millions of real people are helped by it - especially via Medicaid expansion. Millions more will be helped with a few sensible tweaks. Tweaks that can be done quickly by flipping a few seats in the Senate. Bernie's take-it-or-leave-it Medicare for All is pie in the sky. But you know that... Cheers, Scott.
Post #428,743 by mmoffitt 5/2/19 1:43:36 PM 5/2/19 1:43:36 PM Reply	Thanks for the link. I'd never find Right Wing Corporatist Propaganda on my own. More important, Sanders’s Medicare for all would put almost all private insurance companies out of business—or diminish them to runts. These companies manage more than $1 trillion in revenue per year ... But no trillion-dollar industry has ever just rolled over and died. Translation: The Corporations are forever. They are superhuman. They cannot be defeated. Do not even attempt it. The ever increasing profits for the shareholders is important. You and the patients are not and never will be because that's capitalism and we love it. He may be correct about that - HERE. We are the most ignorant, fucked up people ever to have walked on this planet. bcnu, Mikem It's mourning in America again.
Post #428,747 by Another Scott 5/2/19 2:09:48 PM 5/2/19 2:09:48 PM Reply	So he's right, but we have to try to do something pointless anyway, because purity? Is that it?
Post #428,768 by mmoffitt 5/3/19 9:03:33 AM 5/3/19 9:03:33 AM Reply	Yeah, what's a soul worth anyway? bcnu, Mikem It's mourning in America again.
Post #428,757 by Another Scott 5/2/19 10:50:15 PM 5/2/19 10:50:15 PM Reply	#HowTheACASavedMyLife https://twitter.com/lpackard HTH. (via LOLGOP) Cheers, Scott.
Post #428,767 by mmoffitt 5/3/19 9:01:13 AM 5/3/19 9:01:13 AM Reply	I never claimed it didn't help anyone. I only claimed that by supporting the PPACA you're ceding decisions about who gets care and who doesn't based exclusively upon their ability to pay the shareholders (MediCare recipients excepted). The bottom line is that you're comfortable with the idea that concerns of shareholder profit and wealth trump concerns of providing healthcare to all of us and that's fine (again - HERE). I'm not. That's the nut of our difference. Your quarrel with me on this topic exclusively concerns my objection to those that do not in any way provide healthcare services continuing to receive enormous amounts of money that would otherwise be spent delivering care. IOW, you believe capitalism is the answer to every concern and I do not. I am curious, though, if you saw this, exactly how you are not moved to join in the calls to remove the profit motive from our healthcare delivery system? bcnu, Mikem It's mourning in America again.
Post #428,769 by Another Scott 5/3/19 9:35:45 AM 5/3/19 9:35:45 AM Reply	Excluded middle.... Recognizing that a $1T healthcare system exists and cannot be replaced with one fell swoop (ala Bernie) does not mean that I'm a fan of insurance companies. Incremental progress, grasshopper... Cheers, Scott.
Post #428,771 by mmoffitt 5/3/19 11:26:15 AM 5/3/19 11:26:15 AM Reply	The "incremental improvements" halted in the early 1970's. At least according to the longest lived member of the original panel that set up Medicare, it was supposed to be next extended to children, then to those over 50. The original intent (according to him) was that by that time, so few would NOT be on it, the mouth-breathers would be more likely to accept putting everyone on it. But then, ..., Nixon. Incremental change has not worked for 50+ years. Also, what are you saying about the 29 year old who died over not being able to pay a for-profit insurance company (on the vaunted Exchange no less) twenty dollars? That's okay? We can't change it because too much money is involved? And the shareholders! God Save the Shareholders! Sorry, I'm not swallowing that poison pill. But you and most Muricans are gobbling them down. With such an attitude prevalent among the Great Murican Peeple, I submit no change at all makes as much sense as "incremental change." At least with no change, maybe the average IQ will increase. It will only cost us what's left of our morality, which, like everything else in this festering pile of manure we call "The United States" has all but vanished in the past forty years. bcnu, Mikem It's mourning in America again.
Post #428,774 by Another Scott 5/3/19 12:04:04 PM 5/3/19 12:04:04 PM Reply	(sigh) Read me in my posts. Your strawman is on fire.
Post #428,772 by boxley 5/3/19 11:49:29 AM 5/3/19 11:49:29 AM Reply	sure it will save lives but a what cost? decimated the health insurance of the middle class to match the crap plans offered the poor was not a great idea "Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
Post #428,744 by mmoffitt 5/2/19 1:45:11 PM 5/2/19 1:45:11 PM Reply	Also, it is incredibly ironic that you cite "Medicaid expansion" whilst denigrating MFA. bcnu, Mikem It's mourning in America again.
Post #428,746 by Another Scott 5/2/19 2:09:09 PM 5/2/19 2:09:09 PM Reply	Medicaid and Medicare are not the same thing.
Post #428,759 by Ashton 5/3/19 3:31:15 AM 5/3/19 3:31:15 AM Reply	I wonder what good-'ol-Joe thinks on this topic IF.. he succesfully accomplishes a lateral-arabesque on All of those--proven utterly Destructive--huge matters in which he was a major-player: Anita Hill and her (own) "hi-tech lynching"/the entire absurdity of 3-Strikes-and you're fucked-for life [even for liking marijuana!] ..and the other foot-in-mouth adventures. He ..Could 'win', y'know? But, as you/I others have indeed echoed; [variants of the Prime Directives] ... nobody ever overestimated the utter--largely via mental laziness + ignorance--credulity of the'Murican public (nor have we ever escaped: [see Alex's sig]. I haven't the foggiest of how this--now myriads!-of--clusterfuck(s) shall move, day-to-Day--let. alone.. months? Years!?--as I'm already convinced that, Americans/overall have Never been-ready-for-Self-government. And such prospects dim every day that the Orange Menace has turned the entire enchilada into: his aberrant-psych-Menagerie/for fun & profit [His]. We're fucking-Fucked as long as 'He' lives (figuratively or actually). I just watch the-particular-daily-Way: in which we Shall all hang together AND separately. And sequentially. (But I don't/shan't stew over the dismal fact ..'framing' is everything; prizing sober-equanimity? is a decent antidote to watching a Ship-of-Fools flounder. Again. As "regularly"--how else? when there are so few active 'Citizenship-capables' extant. (Or one could recall marlowe's unwitting-prescience in posting that cartoon, "It's a Quagmire!") Maybe too: Venezuela cum Drumpfish Hawkish maneuvering 'R US --> regressively. Too. er, qed. But.. Hey! We're In-credible! :-)

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