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New Unrolled Trevor Sumner thread.
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1106934362531155974.html

A good, quick, read.

tl;dr - it's not a software problem, it's a system problem.

(via Cheryl Rofer's Twitter feed.)

Cheers,
Scott.
New Just now, too: AXIOS gives a 'cubic-closest-packing'/incisive Summary of the 'issues' (an hour ago)
Axios plus several al punte links.
(Sure beats looking for original-Gems within the litany of "replies" to each new pronouncement!)

It seems though--already--that, the Special Drumpf-infected DEAL via which this *NEW* model made a lateral arabesque around ALL the usual training/Simulator preludes to airworthiness-Cert of ANY NEW MODEL, via the transparently-iffy rubric, "we just made a few improvements": shall become the root basis for $$$n-B successful suits, assuredly already in Legal prep ... worldwide.

Secondarily: the blithe PRESUMPTION that "pilots don't NEED TO KNOW (even that this fly-by-wire feature exists)", added to such facts as: the dis-U.S. FAA, run like all the other directorates by a TEMP-employee and for the obvious reason that EVERY slot (of the few even-yet 'filled' by Drumpf): is either manifestly incompetent or actively-biased via ties to the industry-to-be regulated:

Just might get the political-aspect finally MADE CLEAR via the 300+ dead-normal-ordinary People: all resulting from the end-run around sanity: of this ludicrous Drumpf-like deal given. Boeing (er, The Art of the Deal writ large? again.)




Natch my Hope is: that this random confluence of events can only intensify the Spotlight on--just how destructively-MUCH the Orange rasPutin has damaged the entire 'Murican position worldwide--and down to local 'school boards' options, etc. etc. A fitting memorial to those needlessly-dead might just be: that their sacrifice could prove to have been one of those tipping-point things of such consequence as: accelerating even planetary matters towards ---> sanity... (surely the 'Real' 'Muricn Dream--if the perps could actually cogitate at all?)

Fingers crossed ..it's a veritable long-shot re that hymn, Sleepers Awake! innit?
(This is becoming fascinating re the What-If?s generated so early-on), ergo the Possibilities -->
New Won't matter
It wasn't "300+ dead-normal-ordinary People" that died. It was 300+ brown people. Totally different thing.
--

Drew
New not really drumpf's fault he was not president in 2011
"Science is the belief in the ignorance of the experts" – Richard Feynman
New Regulation is only part of the FAA's mandate.
It also includes "Encouraging and developing civil aeronautics, including new aviation technology." These two things are often in conflict.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New Re: On LionAir, pilots were never even told about the MCAS
I am by no means a professional pilot, but it seems to me a bit ridiculous for any pilot to sit in the left (or right) seat of a new airplane and *not* comprehensively review the panel. During my primary flight training, I flew three different aircraft with distinctly different panels and equipment. I sat in the seat of those three aircraft for a long time figuring out where everything was and what the new stuff (gps system was present in one) before I ever started the engine. Mind you, these were very basic small aircraft with comparatively trivial instruments and systems aboard.

For the 737Max, there are new "cut-out switches" plainly visible in the panel. Are we to believe that these pilots looked at those switches, didn't know what they were and didn't bother to find out? That doesn't strike me as remotely believable. But, Trump is our president and that's about as easy to comprehend, I suppose.
bcnu,
Mikem

It's mourning in America again.
New You posted a pic of that module.. which prompted moi to stare at it for some. time.
{while pondering the Significance of what 'skipping-over its exact capabilities' ..means for us all, on a much larger Scale} Ugly, that.

WHY did none of these Pros *demand exact and full DISCLOSURE* of the reason for this module AND all-about-its-guts (??) My first Q on peeping the module: is it conceivable that those about to fly their first MAX would NOT ask selves Query 1: w.t.f.does it Do, and HOW does it Do it? Second: What might it.. do-Rong??? and how do I *fully* disable it --> (once I get Query 1 answered).

(And I'd bet a C-note that None Of These newbies *guessed, from the idiot-iPad-Intro: just how Incessantly the sucker would re-ENGAGE INDEFINITELY: after Five Fucking Seconds!
* because, as now we know: NONE of the newest pilots of this machine were told that the System Existed, let alone its dependence on ONE sensor, the idiot-fact that: in these repeated 5-second stabs: the vertical elevator would increment DOWN all-the-way.

And even moi can deduce that the jackscrew moves that sucker s l o w l y ..so that even if a brilliant pilot grokked what was happening: (and had already run out of UP-correction via the much smaller trim-tabs): The Plane had NO CHANCE because turning that screw back to ^UP^ ... would take more time than the takeoff altitudes attained (already dangerously decreased from porpoising via the ferocity of each cumulative NOSE-down update! to the jackscrew).

Methinks that the Chief Engineer in this project just might be liable for criminal charges: for the absurdities already discovered, the secrecy of the MCAS system and the failure to demand triple-redundancy within a logic-choice so inescapably fatal (if any of a number of steps malfunctioned.)

I ain't no genius: if I could out-Think the tribe of Boeing's engineers, at first-glance! as each new factoid emerged: THAT IS SCARY re. all those geese within that spam-in-a-can coffin-in-waiting ..for a bad transistor.
THIS-all is on the same scale of IGNORANCE as got us the short-fingered-vulgarian and his gaggle of fellow mobsters. (So what are the ODDS?? that this banana-republic shall ever ACT-proportionally to the PERIL re climate ..until way past Tipping-Point #2, 3 arrive.) {don't answer that}

That a savvy org. like Boeing can push this FUBAR into --> sales-to-Users sans more than ONE simulator then in existence! ... seems the leitmotif re the ODDS on so unprecedented a matter as CLIMATE: being judged/funded by a Congress, Judiciary. Liar-in-Chief ... within which groups (I'd bet another C-note or two) ~90% of the members have no idea what Ohm's Law is, why it matters in so many places etc. Never mind Mr. Ohm---these folk are often both illiterate in science and most 'Muricans remain innumerate in all things. We Learn ever-so-slowly; thence we Act glacially. A q.e.d. death-knell. ie Ask-not what you can do for your planet ..launch an IPO.



I no longer stress the little-grey-cells, imagineering [n+1] possible ways that an accelerated DROP-PETROLEUM methodology might succeed (worst of all: we COULD actually have all that success==MONEY antediluvian reptilian-$$baggage) ... while saving our asses too. And I'll be damned if I shall 'become depressed' over: what surely is {some form of} Cosmic Decision that: this species is too deadly to Every Life Form.. to be allowed to continue. I shall simply meditate upon such WISDOM as is--apparently forever--beyond 'our' ken.

..works por moi.:-)
(too much Mahler ..doesn't really create endorphins though) :-/
     IT.-related [Boeing]: re s/ware bug + bad pointer veils actual cause + Addendum "How To Run 2.5 yrs: - (Ashton) - (43)
         Unrolled Trevor Sumner thread. - (Another Scott) - (6)
             Just now, too: AXIOS gives a 'cubic-closest-packing'/incisive Summary of the 'issues' (an hour ago) - (Ashton) - (3)
                 Won't matter - (drook)
                 not really drumpf's fault he was not president in 2011 - (boxley)
                 Regulation is only part of the FAA's mandate. - (mmoffitt)
             Re: On LionAir, pilots were never even told about the MCAS - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                 You posted a pic of that module.. which prompted moi to stare at it for some. time. - (Ashton)
         NewYorker article gets it right re. techno and the legal investigation(s) in transit - (Ashton) - (1)
             But "Bidness is SO much better at *EVERYTHING* than Government Bureacrats", no? -NT - (mmoffitt)
         They fought MCAS "more than two dozen times" and it never occurred to them to turn it off? - (mmoffitt) - (27)
             I don't follow that conclusion. - (malraux) - (26)
                 Read the FARs. - (mmoffitt) - (24)
                     Every plane ever made is 100% tech -NT - (drook) - (3)
                         Also: vaccines for preventable childhood diseases that are otherwise miserably fatal - (pwhysall)
                         Should have been more clear: Information Technology (i.e. computers and software) -NT - (mmoffitt) - (1)
                             Which are used to design all of these wonders of the modern age. -NT - (malraux)
                     Meh. - (Another Scott) - (14)
                         "Airline mechanics tried four times since Oct. 26" says it all: how Know they had Fixed it, then? - (Ashton)
                         It is definitely not a "cop out". Them's the rules and every pilot knows it. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (12)
                             Somehow I don't think that the pilots are going to get the lion's share of the blame in these cases. -NT - (Another Scott) - (11)
                                 heh. You don't know the FAA. -NT - (mmoffitt) - (10)
                                     Reuters today. - (Another Scott) - (9)
                                         I'll make you a bet. - (mmoffitt) - (8)
                                             Naah. We'll see. -NT - (Another Scott)
                                             ..think that: *THIS* time, there's been far too much Ink properly flung - (Ashton) - (4)
                                                 The FAA's mission is schizophrenic. - (mmoffitt) - (3)
                                                     So promotion is the goal, safety is a tactic -NT - (drook) - (2)
                                                         Yes, of course, Polly. -NT - (mmoffitt)
                                                         ..as Murican as cyanide-laced *Apple Pie, innit? - (Ashton)
                                             More from Reuters. - (Another Scott) - (1)
                                                 Um, yeah, it kinda was. - (mmoffitt)
                     ? - (malraux) - (4)
                         Did I even mention "root cause"? No. I did not. - (mmoffitt) - (3)
                             so how do you feel about self driving tractor trailers? :-) -NT - (boxley) - (1)
                                 Have those all you want. After I'm dead. ;0) -NT - (mmoffitt)
                             Then be more clear with what you're saying. - (malraux)
                 This logic is impeccable. Or I ain't got no cuth at all. Thanks for Beautiful concision! - (Ashton)
         More more from Reuters - (Another Scott) - (5)
             If this turns out to be true... - (mmoffitt) - (4)
                 Boeing has taken responsibility for both crashes now - (malraux) - (3)
                     BS - (crazy) - (2)
                         That's the part I don't get - (drook)
                         Yeah... - (Another Scott)

You signed the Memo of Understanding...!
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