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New Re: A couple of points you raise ...
"As for the impact that XML will have on the world, I don't know what that will be like. But I
suspect that it will be less than the hype has it. Why? Very simply because XML requires all
parties involved to look at the same numbers, label them the same way, and think of them
the same way. That works very well in a homogenous business, or if a small number of
suppliers dominate a vertical market. But it stops working so well where different industries
have to interface. And it runs counter to how competition in business proceeds."

But this was why the XML Schema was intoduced & why the Schema is integral to Web Services.

For this shebang to work both parties *have* to accept the published schema - not doing so is akin to a sender & receiver of a shipping container, both arguing over different bill of ladings for the one container. The Schema for a service gets published & subscribing to the service means you have adopted the common schema that defines the contents.

I agree that for example, the auto industry has many factions & some may decide to adopt a different schema than another faction say for ordering spare vehicle parts (this is probably going to happen) but even if it does, XML provides the XSL family to make the job of bringing incompatible schema formats together.

XML is extremely well thought out (as were the 2 main container sizes). There are bound to be orgs who want to ignore what becomes popular
but as in the shipping container world, they may well get trampled in the standards compliant traffic.

Also XML is actually a family of technologies - web services as a concept that extends XML and exploits many aspects of the XML family.

POINT 2 *****************

"What this means is that attempts to homogenize how businesses interact with each other
run counter to the businesses real need to each be different. Of course there are huge
savings in transaction costs in being homogeneous, so businesses walk a fine line between
what to be homogenous on, and what to not be. But the closer you get to the core
business processes, the more they each need to be different. (Which is one of the
fundamental reasons that most of the software development done in this world is in-house
- and why that will remain the case.)"

Yes, each business tends to adopt a unique set of processes that differentiates the services they offer. All XML & Web Services is likely to do is speed up the ability of businesses to define new & quicker adapting processes that provide a faster time-to-market.

There are many analogies in manufacturing - the just-in-time ordering of raw materials replaced stockpiling raw materials - cut costs, provided better business cash-flow, reduced obsolesence etc: - all brought about by IT offering more reliable ordering capacity (such as EDI).

Now EDI - that is what is going to be heavily impacted by web services - in effect WS is EDI for the masses & at the same time is a vastly more open & superior concept. But EDI is crucial the big buainess & supply-chain / logistics industries. Re EDI, it is UNCEFACT that is driving EDI/ebXML.















Cheers

Doug
Collapse Edited by dmarker2 June 10, 2002, 08:48:52 AM EDT
Re: One point you raise ...
"As for the impact that XML will have on the world, I don't know what that will be like. But I suspect that it will be less than the hype has it. Why? Very simply because XML requires all parties involved to look at the same numbers, label them the same way, and think of them the same way. That works very well in a homogenous business, or if a small number of suppliers dominate a vertical market. But it stops working so well where different industries have to interface. And it runs counter to how competition in business proceeds." But this was why the XML Schema was intoduced & why the Schema is integral to Web Services. For this shebang to work both parties *have* to accept the published schema - not doing so is aking to a sender & receiver of a shipping container, both arguing over different bill of ladings for the one container. The Schema gets published & subscribing to the service means you have adopted the common schema that defines the contents. I agree that for example, the auto indusrty has many factions & some may decide to adopt a different schema than another faction (this is sure to happen) but even if it does, XML provides the XSL family to make the job of bringing incompatible schema formats together. XML is extremely well thought out (as were the 2 main container sizes). There are bound to be orgs who want to ignore what becomes popular but as in the caotainer world, they may well get trampled in the standards compliant traffic. Cheers Doug
Expand Edited by dmarker2 June 10, 2002, 08:57:38 AM EDT
     Possible effects from any drastic changes to IT - (dmarker2) - (20)
         This reminds me of COBOL in the 60's. - (a6l6e6x) - (2)
             Re: Just ask a Smalltalk programmer - 'ST is sooo simple' - (dmarker2)
             Sort of - (orion)
         What is IT, and how does this make them obsolete? - (ben_tilly) - (12)
             Re: Am sure we agree, issue is the question - (dmarker2) - (10)
                 XML can't kill IT - (ben_tilly) - (9)
                     Re: I am sure that is agreed (?) - (dmarker2) - (7)
                         To quote one writer on the subject . . - (Andrew Grygus) - (6)
                             XML is a container for content - (orion) - (5)
                                 Re: XML is ... Some of the definitions - (dmarker2) - (4)
                                     Gracias. - (Ashton) - (1)
                                         Re: XML is ..., WebSvcs are ... (part 2) ... - (dmarker2)
                                     Not so analogous to containerization, then. - (CRConrad) - (1)
                                         Re: Actually from several aspects - (dmarker2)
                     Re: A couple of points you raise ... - (dmarker2)
             Well, it won't affect my job - (tonytib)
         Web Services Certainly NOT! Cheaper Labor And Attitudes! - (gdaustin) - (3)
             I think there are two problems here - (drewk) - (1)
                 Perhaps I should have qualified.... - (gdaustin)
             Health care - (ChrisR)

Nearly sentient.
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