Today's the day!

Post #394,743 by pwhysall 9/18/14 1:49:50 AM Reply	Today's the day! Place your bets! Will Scotland vote to separate from the UK? Or will wiser heads prevail? BET NOW!
Post #394,749 by Another Scott 9/18/14 8:07:23 AM 9/18/14 8:18:19 AM Reply	I say... No, with a couple of percent margin. (Just a wild guess.) Then the battles over "DevoMax"-like changes begin. [edit:] A good comment in a good thread at B-J. Cheers, Scott. Edited by Another Scott Sept. 18, 2014, 08:18:19 AM EDT Expand All History
Post #394,752 by a6l6e6x 9/18/14 9:12:54 AM Reply	I'm with AS here. And how strange is that that is Another Scott! NO by 2 percent. Alex "There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." -- Isaac Asimov
Post #394,755 by malraux 9/18/14 11:32:51 AM Reply	Re: Today's the day! So close it will require a recount, and once again Florida will decide it. Regards, -scott Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.
Post #394,756 by Another Scott 9/18/14 11:53:18 AM Reply	rofl.
Post #394,757 by pwhysall 9/18/14 12:11:01 PM Reply	They can take our lives, but they can't take our hanging chads.
Post #394,758 by malraux 9/18/14 12:21:21 PM Reply	Is that what's under a kilt? Regards, -scott Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.
Post #394,759 by pwhysall 9/18/14 12:28:25 PM Reply	We'll never really know.
Post #394,760 by malraux 9/18/14 12:34:35 PM Reply	Well... If the wearer's name is Chad, it's pretty sure that that's what is under his kilt. Regards, -scott Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.
Post #394,761 by Another Scott 9/18/14 1:25:31 PM Reply	Felix says it will be "Yes" Medium: He made up his mind on September 6. A yes vote in Scotland this week would be a very, very bad idea. Anybody who looks at it taking an on-the-one-hand, on-the-other-hand approach is going to end up voting No, as they should. But I’m not going to rehearse all of the No campaign’s arguments here. Instead, I’d like to try to explain, to a largely befuddled American audience, how on earth the UK found itself on the verge of divorce. As I see it, there are five main necessary conditions to explain how we got here: - The EU - The 1979–1997 Tory government - The 2003 Iraq war - The 2008 financial crisis - The 2010 UK general election [...] He makes a good case. Cheers, Scott.
Post #394,762 by pwhysall 9/18/14 1:31:43 PM 9/18/14 1:38:17 PM Reply	Interesting piece ETA: Overlooks the 1979 referendum, though. ETA2: Also, this is wrong: To a first approximation, everybody in England wants Scotland to vote no. At the beginning of August, that would have been correct. However, the Yes campaign's delusional, disingenuous, toxic and anti-English approach has led to a significant amount of support for the "Will you please just fuck off, you insufferable sweaties!" point of view. I wouldn't be surprised to see that viewpoint held by a third of the populace. Edited by pwhysall Sept. 18, 2014, 01:34:22 PM EDT Edited by pwhysall Sept. 18, 2014, 01:38:17 PM EDT Expand All History
Post #394,767 by malraux 9/18/14 3:31:49 PM 9/18/14 3:32:24 PM Reply	Re: Today's the day! The Natural Result Regards, -scott Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson. Edited by malraux Sept. 18, 2014, 03:32:24 PM EDT Expand All History
Post #394,776 by a6l6e6x 9/19/14 12:12:40 AM Reply	:-) ! Alex "There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." -- Isaac Asimov
Post #394,769 by crazy 9/18/14 4:20:22 PM Reply	If it was me, It'd be no But it's not me. So "yes" for purely emotional reasons.
Post #394,772 by gcareaga 9/18/14 7:57:59 PM Reply	The United Kingdom of Pretty Good Britain and Northern Ireland Lacks a certain grandeur. It'll be no, followed by devo max.
Post #394,778 by pwhysall 9/19/14 2:00:03 AM Reply	It's a NO, by 55% to 45% Post-mortem: The "No" campaign was crap, but then it always was going to be. Arguing for the status quo is always going to be hard. However, dull but worthy won out, and here's why: Salmond built the "Yes" campaign on wishful thinking. Now, it's arguable whether the concomitant deceit was deliberate, or the result of genuine delusion, but the facts are plain: Salmond literally denied reality on the following absolutely 100% mission-critical points: * He stated that there would be a currency union, and continued to do so after every major English political party, and the governor of the Bank of England said there would not * He stated that Scotland would continue as an EU member state, and continued to do so after a veritable cavalcade of authorities on the matter said that Scotland would have to apply to join and membership would depend on meeting the necessary Article 48 criteria (even in a perfect world, that's a grindingly slow process. You might be able to wrap it up inside a decade. Turkey applied in 1987, and they're still not in.) * He massively overstated the amount of money that would be available from oil revenues, and continued to do so when impartial analysts said "uh, no, your guys have overstated the numbers, and they've been doing that for quite a while" And so on. It didn't help that the SNP costings for the actual split were ludicrously low. Scots aren't stupid.
Post #394,779 by Ashton 9/19/14 3:06:27 AM Reply	Glad your neighbor blokes have good BS-detectors. I gather that the projections of a squeaker demonstrated (again) that polling guesstimates are universally about as accurate as Econ predictions. (PBS here is doing a marathon series on The Roosevelts; tonight covered his extraordinary actions on first election--almost immediately flashing into action on numerous fronts: this-all after Hoover's merely/silently watching the place go down in flames. Superb use of the medium, especially for the young'uns without a historical clue.) We're still in a Depression here--never mind the euphemisms--for a majority, nor is Euro free of many impending variants. Your kleptocracy seems a bit better-caged than our handful of slavering overlords. Wonder if this little soap-opera interlude bodes ill or healthy? for any sunnier outlook (long-term self-sufficiency, that is) in Blighty?. (I do expect better thinking over there; your peeps aren't nearly as demented.) They showed tonight an excellent quality clip of The Führer's little Reichstag skit re FDR's list of 31 nations: asking him to certify that, he wouldn't invade(!?) Commentator observed, "obviously he deemed the US to be no threat.." (Scary seeing this--with full realization of just what this single! psychopath was about to do/and did. Nukes? we shouldn't even have Bronze Age weapons.)
Post #394,782 by Another Scott 9/19/14 8:00:27 AM Reply	Surprising, but YouGov had it roughly right (54% No, 46% Yes). They seem to have known what they were doing. Am I right in thinking that Cameron really messed this whole exercise up? Apparently the vote would have been overwhelmingly for "DevoMax" if that had been a choice. Now, the Scots will end up with something like DevoMax anyway after all of the promised concessions to keep the Scots from voting to leave. Of course, it would have been much worse for Cameron and the rest of Parliament if Scotland had voted to leave. Over here, there were screams for decades about "Who lost China" - Imagine the yelling about "Who lost Texas"... ;-) Is Cameron now a lame duck? Is it the straw that breaks the camel's back? If so, what's next for Parliament? Interesting times... Thanks. And congratulations! :-) Cheers, Scott.
Post #394,784 by pwhysall 9/19/14 8:47:21 AM Reply	Rule 1 Of Referenda Don't put three things on them.
Post #394,783 by a6l6e6x 9/19/14 8:38:00 AM Reply	A wider win than I expected. But, should have known it would be solid. The pound/dollar ratio had moved 2 cents yesterday, a volatile move. So, the moneyed knew. Alex "There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge." -- Isaac Asimov
Post #394,792 by Andrew Grygus 9/19/14 10:49:00 AM Reply	Well, whre's the fun in that?

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