Post #386,856
2/25/14 12:51:29 PM
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nonsense
Stop trying to force everyone into complying your outdated social norms.
Gay is normal. Get the fuck over it. No one is forcing you to have gaysex or get gaymarried or indeed be fabulous in any way.
All we want is for people who do want to have gaysex and gaymarriage and to be fabulous to have the same rights and privileges as the rest of us.
Your position is one of insidious enablement, quietly giving weight to those who think that it's perfectly fine to discriminate against gays, all the way along the continuum from not selling wedding flowers to beating them to death for not being attracted to the "correct" gender.
It is indefensible.
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Post #386,860
2/25/14 1:12:03 PM
2/25/14 1:16:30 PM
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Normal is the wrong word.
You mean "broadly accepted." I actually don't have a problem with that nor would I argue that homosexuality is not now broadly accepted. But it remains atypical in the species.
All this handwringing of "the reason they don't want to contribute" to an event. To hell with their reasons! I don't care what their reasons are. They should have the right to say, "No, I'm not participating/contributing to this or that" for any damned reason they want to give (or not). Everyone here seems perfectly content to let that right slip away, too. THAT is indefensible.
Edit: clarity
Edited by mmoffitt
Feb. 25, 2014, 01:16:30 PM EST
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Post #386,862
2/25/14 1:18:15 PM
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Blue eyes are "atypical". Being over 2 meters tall is also.
I really don't understand why you're continuing to walk farther and farther out on this plank.
:-(
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #386,866
2/25/14 1:30:00 PM
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Sigh. The erosion of rights troubles me.
It bothers me when a herd demands that everyone follow in their footsteps. Maybe it's because I've tended toward contrarianism since I was 10. But the right of the individual to stand against the herd and say, "No. That's not right and I'm not going along with it just because the majority believes it" has always been important to me. Even if that individual is wrong, he ought to have the right to follow his own conscience in all of his daily affairs. We've apparently legislated against that. And I'm troubled by it. The justices in the photographer's case apparently were convinced that the photographers were genuinely trying to follow their consciences. And the law thwarted them. While I'll have to admit that sacrificing one's convictions for the sake of commerce is the American Way, embracing that philosophy comes at great cost to the individual.
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Post #386,873
2/25/14 2:14:22 PM
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Businesses . are . different.
There's nothing preventing Mr. Baker and Ms. Florist and Mr. Candlestickmaker from expressing their political and religious views about "others" away from their businesses.
Even if that individual is wrong, he ought to have the right to follow his own conscience in all of his daily affairs.
Don't you see the giant hole that you've made in civil society when you equate the conduct of a business with "all of his (private) daily affairs"?
If you explicitly allow discrimination against gays (as much of this legislation explicitly (or nearly) does), it invites other carve-outs for other 'undesirables'. It's the same way that people who are against contraception have been acting. "Well, I'm not going to serve you because you refuse to sell your daughter into bondage/aren't circumsized/have pierced ears/live on the other side of the tracks/can't read/are a member of the wrong political party/didn't vote for my brother/etc., etc., etc."
These public accommodation laws are in place for good reasons.
How is a gay couple buying flowers or a cake hurting anyone? How is it destroying civilization any more than being a member of a church different than you?
A person hurting others isn't "following their conscience".
My $0.02. I think I'm done.
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #386,876
2/25/14 2:57:38 PM
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Weddings.Are.Not.People.
Where you see "discrimination against gays" I see "discrimination against gay weddings". Those two things are markedly different in my mind. I think you ought not be entitled to the former, but I think you should be entitled the latter.
You don't. I do. We're not going to agree and that's okay.
Now, I'm done. ;0)
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Post #386,877
2/25/14 3:00:10 PM
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(One more thing) Read the judge's decision again.
They said they wouldn't sell them a civil union cake, either.
It's not about a wedding, its about who the customers were.
That's not permitted.
You can have the last word. :-)
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #386,882
2/25/14 3:52:21 PM
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42. ;0)
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Post #386,868
2/25/14 1:30:49 PM
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then maybe find a profession that does not serve the public?
We were in Philadelphia MS a few weeks ago. My wife forgot to pack her belt. I remembered a black owned store uptown that had all kinds of neat stuff. I was last there a few years ago. Apparently that business had folded and was an upscale boutique. This is 2014. The 6 white women in the store stared at us like we had 20 foot flames shooting out of our asses. I asked the lady behind the counter if they had any belts. She was flustered and stammered maybe, over there on the wall. My wife said, lets go. You could hear the yapping start as the door was closing. Apparently that is ok because they have the right to act like that. Walmart had belts with no issues selling it to us.
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 58 years. meep
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Post #386,871
2/25/14 1:55:47 PM
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No, that is NOT okay.
I'm offended you'd suggest that I might think so.
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Post #386,874
2/25/14 2:34:20 PM
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what if 2 gay men went in? I would assume the same reaction
why is it ok to do it to them?
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 58 years. meep
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Post #386,875
2/25/14 2:52:16 PM
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It isn't. I never said it was.
That's wholesale discrimination. Not at all the same thing as not making a wedding cake or taking their wedding pictures for them.
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Post #386,878
2/25/14 3:08:46 PM
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Oh...
I didn't kill them officer... the Handgun firing the bullets did.
--
greg@gregfolkert.net
"No snowflake in an avalanche ever feels responsible." --Stanislaw Jerzy Lec
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