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New Republican "compassion" at its finest

Republican Gov. Tom Corbett has announced a major assault on the food stamp program that feeds 1.8 million Pennsylvanians, including 439,245 in Philadelphia. http://articles.phil...m-food-assistance Pennsylvania's Department of Public Welfare announced that on May 1, people under 60 with more than $2,000 in savings or other assets will be barred from receiving food stamps. People over 60 would have a $3,250 cap.

[...]

Eliminating “waste, fraud and abuse” is an old and recurrent refrain from those who seek to dismantle the country's social welfare system. But it's a cynical ruse: 30 percent of those eligible for food stamps in Pennsylvania don't receive them. According to federal data, the Inquirer notes, Pennsylvania has a fraud rate of just one-tenth of 1 percent.

Conservatives frequently bristle at the idea that poor people might have nice things while receiving public assistance ("they have a television on welfare!"). But Pennsylvania will now create the most bizarre of disincentives: dissuading poor people from saving.

“We all know that families need to save money to get off government assistance and achieve self-sufficiency,” according to a press release http://www.hungercoa...vings-food-stamps from Carey Morgan, Executive Director of the Greater Philadelphia Coalition Against Hunger.

“So it’s not only inhumane, but counterproductive to force people to drain their savings before they can get any help. Someone with less than $2,000 in the bank would easily be wiped out by one visit to the emergency room.”

[...] “Food stamps are really the only functioning part of the safety net,” the New York Coalition Against Hunger's Joel Berg told The Nation. “It’s the only thing left.”



http://crooksandliar...bar-food-stamp-re






"Chicago to my mind was the only place to be. ... I above all liked the city because it was filled with people all a-bustle, and the clatter of hooves and carriages, and with delivery wagons and drays and peddlers and the boom and clank of freight trains. And when those black clouds came sailing in from the west, pouring thunderstorms upon us so that you couldn't hear the cries or curses of humankind, I liked that best of all. Chicago could stand up to the worst God had to offer. I understood why it was built--a place for trade, of course, with railroads and ships and so on, but mostly to give all of us a magnitude of defiance that is not provided by one house on the plains. And the plains is where those storms come from."

-- E.L. Doctorow
New you got 2k cash and want me to buy your food?
you see this . it is a tiny violin you can play suck me gently on
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New "... or other assets..."
New This just means...
That they'll keep the money in the safe or under the mattress.

To be honest with money in savings garnering less than 1% real interest per year, it really doesn't cost much to avoid traceable money, these days.

Just keep fostering that distrust of the Government there Boxley. Its well placed at this point, but some day we are going to have to realize:

http://www.facebook....7788&l=682a23c8f6
New let's see how well you survive
when you've been unemployed for at least 6 months, maybe even closer to a year, and have barely more than $2000 in the bank.

Now let's take away your food stamp allotment.

Your life just got rougher. You still have rent and utilities (a mortgage if you own, but at this point you're now in risk of getting evicted for non-payment). Your unemployment has ended, so unless you're doing something for cash under the table you have absolutely ZERO income. But you and the kiddies still have to eat, so with your next purchase your bank account drops below 2 grand, and no more food stamps.

Good luck.




"Chicago to my mind was the only place to be. ... I above all liked the city because it was filled with people all a-bustle, and the clatter of hooves and carriages, and with delivery wagons and drays and peddlers and the boom and clank of freight trains. And when those black clouds came sailing in from the west, pouring thunderstorms upon us so that you couldn't hear the cries or curses of humankind, I liked that best of all. Chicago could stand up to the worst God had to offer. I understood why it was built--a place for trade, of course, with railroads and ships and so on, but mostly to give all of us a magnitude of defiance that is not provided by one house on the plains. And the plains is where those storms come from."

-- E.L. Doctorow
New I have not been unemployed for a while
and I dont have 2k in the bank, not much sympathy here
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Yeah, why let people get benefits their taxes paid for.
New Re: Yeah, why let people get benefits *MY* taxes paid for.
There fixed it for you.
New Yeah, only land owners should be able to vote, also too.
New Was that an assumption that those getting any
benefits never paid in?

Or was that an assumption that Box would make that assumption?
New foodstamps for a family of 4 who has a single earner
who can barely cover rent no problem. Or even for non earners, no problem. If you make enough to have 2k in the bank buy yer own food.
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Is a car an "asset" in this case?
The PDF application form asks about "liquid resources" - http://www.dpw.state...ment/s_001565.pdf

Should someone have to sell their car to get food stamps? PA says no.

https://www.humanser...x?Language=EN#CA5

Cheers,
Scott.
New My first thought was houses, not cars
I didn't see much on that either.
New is a car a liquid asset? Not really
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New lincoln's quote excerpt doesn't say "liquid".
The original story/linky seems to have changed. Here's another:

http://www.yorkdispa.../penn/ci_19719563

[...]

In its letter, a Department of Public Welfare official wrote that the proposed asset test would bar anyone under 60 from receiving food stamps if they have more than $2,000 in savings or assets subject to the rule. The limit would be $3,250 for households with someone who is over 60 or disabled.

Advocates for the poor are criticizing the plans, saying the asset limit proposed is unusually punitive and will create barriers for people who genuinely need the federal food subsidy. In addition, imposing the test could absorb caseworkers' time and create delays for people who genuinely qualify, they said.

But Miller said the outlines of the asset test included in the letter were not necessarily final and were based on the previous asset test imposed by Pennsylvania before then-Gov. Ed Rendell did away with it in 2008.

The assets of many recipients were already screened for other welfare programs and dropping the test would encourage low-income households to save more, his administration said at the time.

Many other states got rid or relaxed asset tests during the recession, although the administration of Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder last year began imposing an asset test, albeit one with higher limits.

Thirty-five other states do not enforce an asset test, while four states have raised their minimum allowable assets to $5,000 or more, according to an analysis by the Washington, D.C.-based nonprofit organization Food Research and Action Center.

Currently, Pennsylvanians can get food stamps if they make 160 percent or less of the federal poverty level—or about $35,300 for a family of four—which puts it in the middle of the pack of states in generosity. But applicants in Pennsylvania who earn more than that may be able to qualify by deducting expenses for things like housing, medical treatment and child or dependent care.

A household with an elderly or disabled member can count income up to 200 percent of the federal poverty level.

Food stamps are designed to subsidize food purchases at grocery stores and supermarkets for the poor. Benefits range in amount; the maximum for a family of four is $668 a month.

Miller said the department believes the asset test would eliminate the benefit for about 2 percent of food stamp recipients. The $2,000 asset limit has been in law since the 1980s, although states are not required to enforce it.


Emphasis added.

Devil's in the details...

Cheers,
Scott.
New from your link
The assets of many recipients were already screened for other welfare programs and dropping the test would encourage low-income households to save more, his administration said at the time
if they can save 2k they can buy their own groceries
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Hmm...
http://articles.phil...ral-poverty-level

Houses and retirement benefits would be exempt from being counted as assets. If a person owns a car, that vehicle also would also be exempt, but any additional vehicle worth more than $4,650 would be considered a countable asset.

Anne Bale, a spokeswoman for DPW, said the asset test was a way to ensure that "people with resources are not taking advantage of the food-stamp program," funded by federal money.

In addition, Bale said, the test was related to DPW Secretary Gary Alexander's initiative to reduce waste, fraud, and abuse across all department programs.

Bale said DPW estimated that 2 percent of the 1.8 million Pennsylvanians receiving food stamps would be affected by the asset test.

The DPW plan caught many by surprise, but has been widely condemned by Philadelphia city officials, business leaders statewide, and advocates for the poor.

They point to federal statistics showing that Pennsylvania has one of the lowest food-stamp fraud rates in the nation: one-tenth of 1 percent.

In fact, the state recently won a federal award for running its program efficiently, federal officials say.

Moreover, about 30 percent of people who are eligible for food stamps in Pennsylvania and throughout the nation don't access them, making the entitlement program under-subscribed.

Critics of the DPW plan say it would particularly punish elderly people saving for their burials, poor people trying to save enough money to get out of poverty, and working- and middle-class people who lost their jobs in the recession and may now have to liquidate assets to feed their families.


You still think it's about saving "taxpayer money"?

Cheers,
Scott.
New never EVER claimed it was about saving taxpayer money
it was fuckem, they got $2k buy yer own groceries.
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Even if that $2k is in a 2nd car they need. Hmm...
New nice word placement there bucky
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Please don't feed the troll
He's just glorying in being a callous, nihilistic shit with the possibility it will annoy others. Please don't feed the troll.
New Post more often then! I need someone to argue with here :-)
New Nope
1 car is a requirement for most families (job, school, etc). 2nd is a luxury.

I spent a long time living in the burbs with a wife and 2 kids and 1 car.

I did NOT enjoy it, but we got by, and cars do not have economy of scale. 2nd car costs just as much if not more. But a single car makes you work out your life a bit more in advance, which also means gas savings.


Edit: This was supposed to be a reply to:
"Even if that $2k is in a 2nd car they need. Hmm... "
Expand Edited by crazy Jan. 13, 2012, 09:46:30 AM EST
New Latest example of the policy...
(The policy of demanding near-poverty to be eligible for assistance that your (and their) taxes paid for.)

http://www.balloon-j...012/04/06/100078/

:-(

Cheers,
Scott.
New Whats wrong with the policy?
Taxpayers will pay millions in medical benefits over that woman's lifetime. Now the husband is hale and healthy, he can ditch her for someone more useful or he can assist in payer a very small portion of her medical costs (admittedly high for him but its his choice)
thay can have a car, house and $3100 in cash. Other than the fact I have two old cars that fits my current life exactly.
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New It makes no sense.
What's wrong with the policy is that it makes no sense. Why should they be forced to live in poverty for the rest of their lives to qualify for assistance? How does it help them; how does it help their children; how does it help society?

If they made $50k a year instead of $15k a year, that would make no meaningful difference to how much the state would or will pay on their $M bills.

Wouldn't a better policy be: If you have a catastrophic medical event, you are guaranteed that the state will use tax revenue for your care. Your family won't have to be destitute to qualify, or meet some dollar limit last changed 20+ years ago.

Treating the need for catastrophic medical insurance, or medical insurance period, as some moral failing is stupid and counter-productive.

Cheers,
Scott.
New if you think owning a house car and 3k in the bank
is poverty then you make waaayy too much money. Must be one o them 1 percenters I keep hearing about. Seriously there must be about 80plus million people in this country who would sell their relatives to be able to afford a house car and have 3k in the bank
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Read the story again.
They'll have no retirement savings. No way to pay for their kids to go to college.

Yes, many people are in that boat.

But the others they're not required to be in that boat for the rest of their lives. They can't accept financial help from family or friends.

He had a job where the employer didn't offer health insurance.

If he had a job where he got too large a raise, they'd lose an equivalent part of their benefits - benefits they paid for.

It's state-enforced poverty for no good reason.

Cheers,
Scott.
New again you claim house car and 3k is poverty, hardly
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New ...
New Charlie's take.
http://www.esquire.c...e-scandal-7890580

Don't miss the comments, too.

Cheers,
Scott.
New yup love me that obamacare
I need to hire someone, the husband has the qualities I need but his wife is a quad and my small business policies would shoot thru the roof if I hire him. Guess what, he aint going to get hired.
Im assuming you have health care coverage of some kind. I do not have any. So yes I am aware of my personal limited options if I break. I will find a way to live without crying thats its unfair that I can never own more that one home and car because I am disabled. I realize that most Americans will spend their entire lives without owning a home.
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Re: yup love me that obamacare

I realize that most Americans will spend their entire lives without owning a home.



wrong:


For starters, the ability of regular folks to buy a home is a relatively new phenomenon in the timeline of American history. "As recently as the 1930s, fewer than 40 percent of adults in American households owned their homes," says Robert Hockett, a law professor at Cornell University in Ithaca, N.Y., who studies organizational and financial law and economics. Only after the Hoover and Roosevelt administration made regulatory changes in the home mortgage industry did the homeownership rate go up.

The housing bubble also exaggerated the rate. From a high of 69.2 percent in 2004, the share of Americans who own their home has fallen to 66.4 percent, which is still a percentage point or two above the rates that predominated from the mid-1960s through the mid-'90s.


http://www.csmonitor...-for-rental-homes




"Chicago to my mind was the only place to be. ... I above all liked the city because it was filled with people all a-bustle, and the clatter of hooves and carriages, and with delivery wagons and drays and peddlers and the boom and clank of freight trains. And when those black clouds came sailing in from the west, pouring thunderstorms upon us so that you couldn't hear the cries or curses of humankind, I liked that best of all. Chicago could stand up to the worst God had to offer. I understood why it was built--a place for trade, of course, with railroads and ships and so on, but mostly to give all of us a magnitude of defiance that is not provided by one house on the plains. And the plains is where those storms come from."

-- E.L. Doctorow
New own, not rent from a bank.
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
New Re: Latest example of the policy...
And this sort of thing is one of the myriad reasons why we communists have better health care for less money.

Why is the US so underpant-wettingly terrified of socialised health care?
New Cold war propeganda.
Socialized anything = Godless Communism = Evil Empire = eternal slavery and/or nuclear annihilation.

It'll take three or four generations to wring this formula out of fly-over America - if it can even be done at all.
New We aren't opposed. We're just stupid.
Our government already pays half or a little better all monies paid for healthcare in this country (MediCare and Medicaid). The last I had actual numbers as a consequence of working for a non-profit healthcare insurance company (2000), the average American spent 80% of what he would spend in his lifetime on medical expenses in the last two months of his life. Since the average American was round about 72 then, guess who was picking up the tab? Our federal government via MediCare - among the most popular of all federal programs. My dad spent a week in the hospital before dying last July. I just saw his bill for that week: $167,000.00. 99% covered via MediCare and Veterans' benefits.

But, we're retarded as is evidenced here: http://politicalhumo...f-My-Medicare.htm

Edit: My own retarded tpyo.
Expand Edited by mmoffitt April 9, 2012, 09:10:58 AM EDT
     Republican "compassion" at its finest - (lincoln) - (36)
         you got 2k cash and want me to buy your food? - (boxley) - (21)
             "... or other assets..." -NT - (Another Scott) - (1)
                 This just means... - (folkert)
             let's see how well you survive - (lincoln) - (18)
                 I have not been unemployed for a while - (boxley) - (17)
                     Yeah, why let people get benefits their taxes paid for. -NT - (Another Scott) - (16)
                         Re: Yeah, why let people get benefits *MY* taxes paid for. - (folkert) - (15)
                             Yeah, only land owners should be able to vote, also too. -NT - (Another Scott)
                             Was that an assumption that those getting any - (crazy) - (13)
                                 foodstamps for a family of 4 who has a single earner - (boxley) - (12)
                                     Is a car an "asset" in this case? - (Another Scott) - (11)
                                         My first thought was houses, not cars - (S1mon_Jester)
                                         is a car a liquid asset? Not really -NT - (boxley) - (9)
                                             lincoln's quote excerpt doesn't say "liquid". - (Another Scott) - (8)
                                                 from your link - (boxley) - (7)
                                                     Hmm... - (Another Scott) - (6)
                                                         never EVER claimed it was about saving taxpayer money - (boxley) - (5)
                                                             Even if that $2k is in a 2nd car they need. Hmm... -NT - (Another Scott) - (4)
                                                                 nice word placement there bucky -NT - (boxley)
                                                                 Please don't feed the troll - (hnick) - (1)
                                                                     Post more often then! I need someone to argue with here :-) -NT - (Another Scott)
                                                                 Nope - (crazy)
         Latest example of the policy... - (Another Scott) - (13)
             Whats wrong with the policy? - (boxley) - (5)
                 It makes no sense. - (Another Scott) - (4)
                     if you think owning a house car and 3k in the bank - (boxley) - (3)
                         Read the story again. - (Another Scott) - (2)
                             again you claim house car and 3k is poverty, hardly -NT - (boxley) - (1)
                                 ... -NT - (Another Scott)
             Charlie's take. - (Another Scott) - (3)
                 yup love me that obamacare - (boxley) - (2)
                     Re: yup love me that obamacare - (lincoln) - (1)
                         own, not rent from a bank. -NT - (boxley)
             Re: Latest example of the policy... - (pwhysall) - (2)
                 Cold war propeganda. - (Andrew Grygus)
                 We aren't opposed. We're just stupid. - (mmoffitt)

I like it warm and pink, with the whip-marks still on it.
133 ms