Post #315,565
10/13/09 11:29:10 AM
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Oh, BS
Your cartwheels is the context.
And the context was someone was listing a variety of possibilities.
At the very far end, he said: "not impossible to defend" that particular option.
Hey, it's not impossible to defend my assumption that you are "xxx".
List you worst case scenario of what you wouldn't want to be accused of.
Based on my interaction with you, I'd say you are a "xxx".
Ok, so this guy is listing the variety of ways people might increase the organ supply. And this IS an option that is not impossible to defend. I could defend it.
Take a guy on a respirator for years. No family. No one taking responsibility for him. He's been brain dead the whole time, no recognizable signals for years.
Someone makes the decision to pull the plug. Who? Who knows. Maybe the nursing home he was dumped into years ago. Someone manages to get a court order to pull the plug. The plug is being pulled no matter what.
Now what? He's got a good liver, lungs, and a bunch of other stuff that will save a dozen people. He's never made his preference known.
Who owns that body at that point, and who gets to make decisions?
I can see many slippery slopes, so don't bother pointing them out. Make this particular decision. What do we do with the body? Give it to a medical school? Burn it? Bury it? And no matter what you with the body, you are making the same decisions.
Does it matter if the decisions are made 10 seconds before final death, as opposed to 10 seconds after?
Now, look at the room filled with people with various conditions that will kill them. Pieces of this guy can save them. Will you be ignoring them during your decision process?
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Post #315,723
10/16/09 10:35:57 AM
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No response I see
Glass houses and rocks and all that.
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Post #315,725
10/16/09 10:50:14 AM
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Didnt know you really wanted an answer
same reason you dont harvest organs from the executed in china, its rude
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Post #315,728
10/16/09 10:55:15 AM
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Nice try
No slippery slope please.
The exact decision process if possible. Including viewpoints across the board. For this situation, not any others.
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Post #315,731
10/16/09 11:12:58 AM
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okay, keep him hooked up until he passes by himself
if he has not hinted, given, wrote down any wishes then his parts are his not yours or the State. Cannibalization doesnt begin until after death in most polite civilizations.
I have my wishes written down with a do not recessitate or feed order just water and no organ harvesting but thats just me.
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Post #315,733
10/16/09 11:53:15 AM
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Hmm
Are they allowed to harvest organs (or other parts) after death?
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Post #315,747
10/16/09 4:30:55 PM
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well, some places make soup
corneas skin bone etc can be used post mortem but most soft tissue like innard etc dont do well
thanx,
bill
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Post #315,749
10/16/09 6:54:50 PM
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Define "death"
Ref: beating heart cadavers.
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Post #315,763
10/17/09 11:06:05 AM
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Re: Define "death"
where you dont get sued for sending them to the morgue
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Post #315,767
10/17/09 2:06:09 PM
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It's the killer, isn't it?
I didn't want to know.
I was asking Box for his opinion based in that magical line in the sand and didn't want that focus. Yet.
Ok Box, from your perspective, various pieces of the body are up for grabs at that magical moment, and none of them are before then.
Since time is of these essence, and the previous answer means nothing in the context of when the decision must be made, please give a bit more.
What is death? I'm going to run with some assumptions I have of you. You believe in some type of afterlife, you believe in the concept of the spirit (not going to define that one) leaving the body, and going somewhere. Right?
You also believe in the possibility of people in near death experiences leaving the body, looking down, watching, etc. Right?
At the moment the person (note that the person is no longer defined as the body, but the leaving spirit), is that person dead? Not "near dead", but dead. Or is it some other aspect?
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Post #315,773
10/17/09 5:10:31 PM
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death is not defined by the dead, but the living
I remember I had a conversation with a friend about taking a bad stroke and being semi vegetative but with a non working body, I would prefer a pillow to the face, my bud wanted the veg fed and cared for until decomposition was well set in. Its not easily defineable,
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