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New on authoritarianism and airline security
I'd like to begin this conversation anew. The subject was introduced in "News picks" of an airline passenger who was pulled out of line because he'd scrawled "[TSA agency head] is an idiot" on the surface of a plastic bag he sent through an airport x-ray machine. Beep thought that this was a fine move on the part of the TSA. I begged to differ. Beep begged to differ from my difference. I in turn...you get the idea.

[link|http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?p=6440005%3EHere's|Here's the outside post] that started the ball rolling. [link|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/content/show?contentid=268864|Here's the IWT thread] from which this response derives.

And here's my last:

TSA screeners are not there to monitor levels of fealty to or dissent from the regime. TSA screeners are (broadly speaking) paid to determine whether boarding passengers are likely to divert aircraft away from their assigned flightplans and into large or famous buildings.

I invited you to consider whether our cheeky passenger would have been interfered with had his clear plastic bag borne a "patriotic" sentiment on the order of "I support our troops and President Bush." You declined to address this point, and I'm going to assume from your silence that you agree that no, the passenger would not likely have aroused the ire of the vigilant screener, although I'd love to see you argue the contrary.
The honorable traveler in question invited, nay sought, the confrontation that he received. The act of writing something he thought "amusing" invited this confrontation. Does this better fit? Have I met your superior liguistic challenge?
Nope.

You see—no, you don't, do you?—the point is that political sentiments written on a plastic bag should not concern a TSA screener unless they say something like "Long live al-Qaeda! Death to Amedrica! Death to the Sears Tower!"

Now, I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that a hijacker who has devised a new way to seize control of a commercial aircraft that somehow solves the problem of hardened access to the cockpit and the ire of fellow-passengers who would rather be featured on a made-for-TV movie as heroes who swarmed the bad'ums and saved the White House/Capitol/Sears Tower/Transamerica Pyramid than as helpless sheep...well, a feller clever enough to think past those obstacles is not likely to announce his intentions on the surface of a ziplock bag. Is he?

You with me so far, Beep, or would you rather this conversation had never happened (hey, I'm cool)?

So we've got the TSA screener, supposedly charged with identifying threats to civilian aviation, and he sees (let's imagine) two plastic bags in the x-ray machine, one praising President Bush and the other dissing Kip Whatsisname. What reason on earth does he have to detain either owner of either plastic bag as a potential threat to airline security?

Not. One. Fucking. Reason. At. All.

You know, if you retain a gram of intellectual honesty, that the guy with the rah-rah sentiment on his plastic bag almost certainly gets a pass. You know from the account we're both discussing that the guy who says bad things about the TSA head gets pulled out of line and given grief. And you don't merely see nothing wrong with this, you all but applaud it.

You should not. We can agree on this: the incident as described is essentially trivial. The passenger was making no particularly profound gesture of dissent, and his punishment consisted of little more than a brief delay, the temporary confiscation of his passport, a moderately tense confrontation with the airport constabulary.

And yet, and yet.

All this proceeded from writing a political sentiment on a plastic bag—not merely apolitical sentiment but the wrong political sentiment. Any rational person will understand that anyone capable of a successful aircraft hijack in 2006 will not announce the fact, or even hint at it in any conscious way, in the course of the boarding process. The TSA screener didn't imagine for a moment that he was detaining a potential hijacker. What he knew was that he was bullying a smart-alec.

This is the United Fucking States of America!! We're supposed to be smart-alecs! Anti-authoritarian! Quirky! Individualist! Skeptical of authority! When the hell did the memo come down that we were all supposed to cringe before our betters?

It gets worse: the monstrous farrago of repressive measures passed the other day by Congress to its eternal infamy permits the Executive broad latitude in designating "enemy combatants," a label which once affixed even to an American citizen effectively drops him down the rabbit hole, assuming that your rabbit is reddish in complexion, has horns instead of ears, and a barbed tail. Yeah, the "man who brought it to himself" had it coming for expressing an opinion that someone way, way down on the Executive org chart didn't like. Under this new law any of us will have it coming should we offend, and while this will likely involve most of us in the event in mere inconvenience, it may be that some untimely instance of sarcasm will come to the attention of someone higher—perhaps not that much higher—up the political foodchain. In that case the unlikely victim becomes an Orwellian unperson: Evidence against me? —Sorry, no can do; national security. Get my story out to the papers? —Not permitted. In that case OH JESUS NOT THE WATERBOAGGGHHHHGH

The "man who brought it to himself" is doing us all a favor, whatever his motives. The old American Republic is slain and rotting, and a monstrous thing, a gigantic imperial maggot is struggling out of the corpse. Can you not smell it, Beep? Is your denial so smug?

cordially,

Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
New Perhaps you missed my point, again for the umpteenth
because my point has continually had nothing to do with the TSA rules, nor the overzealousness of those chosen to enforce it, nor the wisdom of those rules, nor the equal application of those rules on "friendlies" that might write "I heart George Bush" instead of "Kip Hawley is an idiot".

In fact, I think I've held that the rules aren't very effective, that the agent in question did over-react, and that in spite of this I feel no obvious sorrow for this man because 1) I have little reason to believe him acting as innocent as his post would like you to believe (and thus possibly even forcing said overzealous TSA man to think him a threat..but this is neither here nor there) and 2) his open invitation to experience EXACTLY what he experienced AND FINALLY both of the former done simply so he could get his 15 minutes of fame...which you apparently are oh, so ready to give him by wasting more bandwidth on this very subject.

Oh, I should add again, that if this is your pointer to the "end of the Repblic", then the Republic has ended long before the current administration, as the ability to speak freely in security lines in an airport has been restricted for many years. Of course, you will likely reply that this last statement is somehow a defense of the current situation/administration instead of a simple statement of fact. However, since I too believe its a free country..and an even freer net connection...you are certainly well within your rights to misinterpret my posts as often as you like.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
New In which case I'm scarcely alone
As I read the entries on this issue thus far, I make it nine of us sharing essentially a common take on the episode and on your response to it, one neutral, and two of you on the side of Righteous Beepitude (I'm giving you boxley as an act of Christian charity). This undoubtedly marks you as a lonely, brilliant iconoclast with the courage to stand up to, ah—what did ol' Norm used to call it, the "IWT Hive Mind"—and I suppose the herd should be properly chastened by your example. On the other hand, one may also entertain the possibility that you have consistently misunderstood the posts to which you have responded and/or crafted your replies so poorly that almost everyone else "misses [your] point again for the umpteenth."

Admittedly the notion beggars credulity, but I mean, it could, y'know, be you.

cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
New Oh, it very well could be
the vote on the board the initial story ran had it somewhere near 65/35 your side.

And as for terminology, for history's sake I prefer the "calumniating pack of yellow wolves." but it is to much the same effect as Norm's chosen.

I don't doubt the sincerity of any person here, nor their defense of what they perceive to be righteous...I do, however, cast aspersion at their current choice of hero.

And damned I appear to be to the depths of 3 monkees seeing, speaking and hearing no evil with our current "junta du jour".

it is, alas, a fate I remain willing to endure for the cause.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
New Stay the course, Beep
You're in good company.

New I'm sure
Scott and Bill thank you.
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
New For the record, I think they're both idiots.
The guy with the bag and the guy who hassled him for it.
Regards,

-scott anderson

"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
New my point as well
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 50 years. meep
New How could you?
Clearly the passenger was simply exersizing his rights...he is the innocent victim of jackboot thuggery.

Unbelieveable you are...being so coy with a man's 1st amendment rights.

Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
New you are a racist nazi, sniff make that a pecksniff
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 50 years. meep
New Thanks man! You too!
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
New So what's your standard for civil disobedience?
I'll ignore for the moment the fact that he wasn't even breaking any laws. But let's suppose he was. Isn't the point of civil disobedience to provoke a reaction, and get yourself hassled over something that shouldn't be illegal?

So yes, let's suppose he did ask for it. Let's suppose he did want his 15 minutes of fame on the blog or -- dare he hope? -- the local news. That doesn't make hassling him okay. Instead, it proves he was right.

I don't feel sympathy for him, nor would I expect you to, so you don't need to point out again how little you feel. He was trying to make a point about the brain-dead, incremental encroachment on our liberties. Everyone who took offense at what he wrote helped him make his point.

Don't tell me he asked for it. He did. Don't tell me it was his own fault. It was. Try, if you can, to not address his tactics again, and instead address his point. Any criticism you care to make about his tactics, I will concede in advance. Now, what should happen to the screener who pulled him aside, and the supervisor who didn't immediately pass him through? What changes should be made in the rules, or in the training of those who enforce them, to make sure this doesn't happen again?
===

Kip Hawley is still an idiot.

===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
New The security guy should at least be reprimanded.
With a memo (from Kip Hawley, natch) telling everyone that they should only be concerned about actual *dangerous*, *illegal* stuff.
Regards,

-scott anderson

"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
New Nit
With a memo (from Kip Hawley, natch) telling everyone that they should only be concerned about actual *dangerous*, *illegal* stuff.
Should read
With a memo (from Kip Hawley, natch) reminding everyone that they should only be concerned about actual *dangerous*, *illegal* stuff.
===

Kip Hawley is still an idiot.

===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
New You SURE?

Imric's Tips for Living
  • Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
  • Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
  • Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.


Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
 
 
New I said it *should* read that
Meaning I would like to think that's the appropriate word to use there. Maybe not.
===

Kip Hawley is still an idiot.

===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
New It wasn't his.
Your mom ever ask you if you would jump after your friends?
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
New So everyone who followed MLK, they didn't mean it?
===

Kip Hawley is still an idiot.

===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
New There you go again
Too much of today's music is fashionable crap dressed as artistry.Adrian Belew
     on authoritarianism and airline security - (rcareaga) - (18)
         Perhaps you missed my point, again for the umpteenth - (bepatient) - (17)
             In which case I'm scarcely alone - (rcareaga) - (16)
                 Oh, it very well could be - (bepatient) - (2)
                     Stay the course, Beep - (Ashton) - (1)
                         I'm sure - (bepatient)
                 For the record, I think they're both idiots. - (admin) - (12)
                     my point as well -NT - (boxley) - (11)
                         How could you? - (bepatient) - (10)
                             you are a racist nazi, sniff make that a pecksniff -NT - (boxley) - (1)
                                 Thanks man! You too! -NT - (bepatient)
                             So what's your standard for civil disobedience? - (drewk) - (7)
                                 The security guy should at least be reprimanded. - (admin) - (3)
                                     Nit - (drewk) - (2)
                                         You SURE? -NT - (imric) - (1)
                                             I said it *should* read that - (drewk)
                                 It wasn't his. - (bepatient) - (2)
                                     So everyone who followed MLK, they didn't mean it? -NT - (drewk) - (1)
                                         There you go again -NT - (bepatient)

None shall pass!
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