Post #257,478
6/1/06 4:02:34 PM
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NY has no landmarks?
[link|http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2006/06/no_icons_no_mon.html|ABC News] New York has no national monuments or icons, according to the Department of Homeland Security form obtained by ABC News. That was a key factor used to determine that New York City should have its anti-terror funds slashed by 40 percent--from $207.5 million in 2005 to $124.4 million in 2006. Once again I am left to wander between total incompetence or outright evil. But I can't decide. Jay
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Post #257,479
6/1/06 4:24:48 PM
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Really? (Lots of images)
[image|http://www.wirednewyork.com/landmarks/liberty/images/statue_of_liberty.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.harlemlive.org/writing-art/essays/nyc/empirestatebuilding.jpg||||]
[image|http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/38210000/jpg/_38210444_cathedralbbc_150.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.world-guides.com/images/new_york/new_york_brooklyn.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.pps.org/imagedb/image-display?image_id=21541||||]
[image|http://www.pbase.com/image/29557589.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.nobelmonument.com/thenobelmonuent/images/nobelmonument.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.italianhistorical.org/VerMonF.JPG||||]
[image|http://www.gardkarlsen.com/new_york/guggenheim_museum_outside2.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.gardkarlsen.com/new_york/hayden_planetarium.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.gardkarlsen.com/new_york/UN_building.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.gardkarlsen.com/new_york/federal_hall_national_monument.jpg||||]
[image|http://www.gardkarlsen.com/new_york/flatiron_building.jpg||||]
[image|http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/27/Timessquare.jpg||||]
Or pretty much anything on the [link|http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_famous_buildings,_sites,_and_monuments_in_New_York_City|List of famous buildings, sites, and monuments in New York City].
[Note] All the above links worked the first time I hit them, some are not coming up now.
===
Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
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Post #257,536
6/2/06 9:12:39 AM
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The Chrysler building!
Without it, we would not have SPIDERMAN MOVIES! With its gothic style Gargoyles.
Dang, and where would we be without it in Godzilla, when they blow about half of it up?
Sheesh... Homeland Security, what a farce!(1)
-- [link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg], [link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwetheyFreedom is not FREE. Yeah, but 10s of Trillions of US Dollars? SELECT * FROM scog WHERE ethics > 0;
0 rows returned. (1) No, this isn't any more of a compelling reason to think this, nor is it less. It is just additional.
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Post #257,501
6/1/06 8:07:58 PM
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Chertoff spins it on the News Hour
He basically said that NY's number last year was abnormally high. If you average the previous 3 years' numbers, then the proposed number for NY is "in line" with that average.
FWIW.
I'm sure his comments will be available at the [link|http://www.pbs.org/newshour/|News Hour] site tomorrow.
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #257,532
6/2/06 8:49:42 AM
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Red-blue divide?
Some people on various bulletin boards regard this is draining money from known, Democrat voting areas. Any thoughts from anybody?
Matthew Greet
Choose Life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol, and dental insurance. Choose fixed interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisurewear and matching luggage. Choose DIY and wondering who the fuck you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing, spirit-crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing your last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked up brats you spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that? I chose not to choose life. I chose somethin' else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who needs reasons when you've got heroin?
- Mark Renton, Trainspotting.
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Post #257,542
6/2/06 10:15:10 AM
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To what avail?
To piss off the democrats and ensure that they get out and vote again? Only place that might have a chance would be in the swing states, those that were marginally blue to get them to swing to red.
My first thoughts.
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. (Herm Albright)
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Post #257,543
6/2/06 10:18:49 AM
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Since the money is basically wasted anyway
it makes sense to spend it on your cronies
A
Play I Some Music w/ Papa Andy
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Post #257,561
6/2/06 11:36:59 AM
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I dunno
In the same story, it states that Illinois, and specifically Chicago, will get substantially more (don't rememeber exact figures, but IIRC there is a double-digit % increase). Illinois is rather bluish, and it don't get more blue that Chicago....
(After all we invented the Blues! :-0 )
jb4
"So don't pay attention to the approval ratings that say 68% of Americans disapprove of the job this man is doing. I ask you this, does that not also logically mean that 68% approve of the job he's not doing? Think about it. I haven't."
— Stephen Colbert, at the White House Correspondent's Dinner 29Apr06
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Post #257,549
6/2/06 10:44:19 AM
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That's an obvious 1st impression.
However, Chertoff claims it was done based on the merits and that he had no imput in deciding which areas got how much money.
Without delving into the details, it's hard to know whether there's hanky-panky going on or not. A DHS press release about the grants is [link|http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/display?content=5667|here] with links to the actual numbers ([link|http://www.dhs.gov/dhspublic/interweb/assetlibrary/grants_st-local_fy06.pdf|2 page .pdf]) and links to other information. Comparing this years numbers to older ones is left as an exercise for the reader.
Do note, though, that California gets more total money in these programs than NY and that's hardly Bush country.
Cheers,
Scott.
(Who agrees it looks like NY and DC are being punished, but who isn't ready to say that that's what's happening. Note that NY's been very good in milking this particular funding source.)
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Post #257,553
6/2/06 11:07:17 AM
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It is certainly possible
The DHS does spend more money on big cities then the rest of the country, but on a per capita basis it favors low population areas. It is hard to say just how much of this bias is anti-democratic bias but it does appear to be there.
Jay
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Post #257,569
6/2/06 2:06:54 PM
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Maybe they said that because...
they need to divert some cash to other cities:
[link|http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/31/washington/31cnd-grant.html?hp&ex=1149134400&en=d2c3b27346543759&ei=5094&partner=homepage|http://www.nytimes.c...&partner=homepage]
Homeland Security Grants to New York Slashed
Published: May 31, 2006
"WASHINGTON, May 31 \ufffd After vowing to steer a greater share of anti-terrorism money to the nation's highest-risk cities, Homeland Security officials today announced grants to New York City and Washington that would be slashed by 40 percent, while dollars headed to spots including Omaha and Louisville, Ky., would surge."
[...] more in article
I guess they have better landmarks, eh?
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Post #257,570
6/2/06 2:14:35 PM
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Well,
considering that NY has already been hit, I guess the logic is "Lightning don't strike twice in the same place". I will admit that since the bulk of my relatives live in the Ohio Valley near Louisville, diverting funds to that area doesn't bother me that much.
a.
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Post #257,574
6/2/06 3:28:01 PM
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Alternately...
We could use the argument that it's good for NYC to get bombed on a regular basis[1], so factor in normal urban development and you've got your numbers back.
[1] For a period[2] after 9/11 the average New Yorker didn't present as quite so gratuitously stupid, arrogant, and rude.
[2] I doubt this lasted more than 6 months, so this may not be the most efficient way to clean up their act for them, but the bombers are responsible for their own ordinance, assuming that we don't donate material for them.
Just a thought...
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Post #257,575
6/2/06 3:57:30 PM
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Well said.
And I meant no offense, just that if the umbrella gets held over my family for a change, so be it.
a.
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Post #257,576
6/2/06 4:09:19 PM
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None taken at all...
On the other paw, if you think letting this bunch of incompetents shuttle money to their friends is going to buy any safety, I have a bridge in NY to sell you it's been in my family for generations...
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Post #257,577
6/2/06 4:32:18 PM
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:-)
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Post #257,579
6/2/06 5:14:17 PM
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Hugh, that was well over the line
I understand that you were trying to joke. But it really doesn't come off well for those of us who were living in NYC during the attack.
Before saying that I'm overly sensitive, please remember, that I was living in NYC during 9/11. Not only that, but I lived in the building that got used to reassemble body parts into reasonably complete corpses. I don't think it unreasonable for me to lack a sense of humor on this topic.
Regards,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #257,581
6/2/06 6:07:43 PM
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Ok, don't laugh
I joke about all kinds of things. I'm not likely to change any time soon. Depending on the topic, varying numbers of people think the joke is funny with the lower limit being 0.
And because I just can't stop myself... You were living there by choice, because it was convenient for you and your wife. Your choice. Not my problem.
Maybe next joke.
Or not. Can't be scintillating all the time...
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Post #257,590
6/2/06 7:13:09 PM
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You should have stopped
You're right that I chose to live there. A choice I wouldn't make again, but a choice I made.
However I think it is no surprise that when I made the choice, I didn't consider the risk of being a possible victim of terrorism very highly in my decision process. You might claim that it was stupidity on my part, it could be argued either way. But certainly my thought process was common pre-9/11.
But go ahead. Continue your "blame and mock the victim" mentality. After all I can't stop you, I can only tell you that I find it offensive.
Regards,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #257,676
6/4/06 8:29:50 AM
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What I find it really offensive...
But certainly my thought process was common pre-9/11 Is the number of people (including our President) who claim they suddenly woke-up on 9/11. Never mind that the Cole was bombed....or our embassies bombed...or the Oklahoma City bombing....or the fact that the World Trade Center was bombed before. (Interesting statical fact - the time between WTC bombing is like 7 years...why do people pride themselves on no attacks in a mere 4 years?) The issue of using planes as weapons isn't new either. (Bush's own unit was nearly called to shoot down a plane that they through was going to be used as a weapon). <Shrug> I guess I'm a little more aware of it. I was 50 miles from Disney (et al) and less than 10 miles from Kennedy Space Center (and Cape Canaveral) and a mere 20 or some from Patrick Air Force Base. I always knew, growing up, that we could be a target. That all said....the joke wasn't funny, sorry.
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Post #257,733
6/5/06 1:23:45 PM
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It's a matter of scale
The other events mentioned were a lot farther away and a lot smaller. I did think about the possibility of the WTC being a target when I moved to NYC. But I didn't think to worry just because I was in NYC.
After 9/11 I did.
Growing up I remember worrying that I could die at any instant. I lived next to one of Canada's 2 naval bases, I'm sure it was on the list. (When I say next, I mean walking distance.)
Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #257,742
6/5/06 2:14:27 PM
6/5/06 2:15:49 PM
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Amen.
Just outside of the city limits of Albuquerque, when I lived there, there was this mountain.... Any guesses what was stored there? (Hint: Consider the proximity to Sandia Labs, Los Alamos, Trinity site, White Sands Missle Range, and the Air Force Weapons Lab (AFWL)....)
Yes, I knew it was there. Yes I knew it was a target. Yes, I lived there on purpose. Any questions, Ben?
jb4
"So don't pay attention to the approval ratings that say 68% of Americans disapprove of the job this man is doing. I ask you this, does that not also logically mean that 68% approve of the job he's not doing? Think about it. I haven't."
— Stephen Colbert, at the White House Correspondent's Dinner 29Apr06
Edited by jb4
June 5, 2006, 02:15:49 PM EDT
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Post #257,680
6/4/06 11:20:13 AM
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do you now take into consideration you might be a target?
I have done so for many years pre 9/11 I chose to live in anchorage because it was a ground zero target during the cold war. Do I think annually casualties of several thousands due to terror attacks worth my freedom that bush is chipping away at? Yes. Did it make most new yorkers (not including you, you have always been likable) put away their nasty attitudes? Yes. Was hugh's humor funny? FUCK YEAH!
I can understand why you didnt think so.
thanx,
bill
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 50 years. meep
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Post #257,704
6/4/06 6:50:57 PM
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Amen, bro!
All things of importance end on the shores of the Hudson river! :)
Just a few weeks after 9/11, while the WTC was still smoldering, I visited my mother in NYC and walked from her house to and around the WTC. My two sisters live in NYC. And still, Hugh is funny.
Bush wories me more than the terrorists.
Alex
When fascism comes to America, it'll be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross. -- Sinclair Lewis
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Post #257,735
6/5/06 1:26:35 PM
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Bush worries me more than terrorists as well
As for the rest, we have a sharp disagreement.
Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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Post #257,734
6/5/06 1:25:08 PM
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Of course I do
It is not my only consideration, but it is a consideration.
Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
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