Post #214,191
7/11/05 11:29:25 AM
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tcpip over the electric grid
[link|http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/printstory.mpl/tech/news/3259278|http://www.chron.com...tech/news/3259278] CenterPoint Energy is testing a system to bring high-speed Internet access to consumers through the medium it knows best \ufffd the electric wall socket.
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The company that owns the power lines throughout Houston is running a pilot of the system in a Greenway Plaza-area residential neighborhood, offering Internet access at speeds more than one-and-a-half times the speed of services offered through cable modems.
The technology, called broadband over power lines, or BPL, has long been used by power companies to monitor and manage their electric grids, said Thomas Standish, chief operating officer of CenterPoint's Electric and Information Technology business.
But it wasn't until recently that it could be used to offer high-quality data, video and voice services. thanx, bill Just call me Mr. Lynch \\
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #214,197
7/11/05 11:52:30 AM
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Radio transmission problems solved?
Everytime someone tries this, it hits the technical snag of turning street lamps into radio transmitters. Has this been solved?
Matthew Greet
Choose Life. Choose a job. Choose a career. Choose a family. Choose a fucking big television, choose washing machines, cars, compact disc players and electrical tin openers. Choose good health, low cholesterol, and dental insurance. Choose fixed interest mortgage repayments. Choose a starter home. Choose your friends. Choose leisurewear and matching luggage. Choose DIY and wondering who the fuck you are on a Sunday morning. Choose sitting on that couch watching mind-numbing, spirit-crushing game shows, stuffing fucking junk food into your mouth. Choose rotting away at the end of it all, pishing your last in a miserable home, nothing more than an embarrassment to the selfish, fucked up brats you spawned to replace yourself. Choose your future. Choose life... But why would I want to do a thing like that? I chose not to choose life. I chose somethin' else. And the reasons? There are no reasons. Who needs reasons when you've got heroin?
- Mark Renton, Trainspotting.
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Post #214,200
7/11/05 12:09:01 PM
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apparently, the article stated they are ready to go
Just call me Mr. Lynch \\
Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 49 years. meep
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #214,202
7/11/05 12:16:48 PM
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No, this is still the same technology.
They haven't addressed the real problem yet.
This is an entirely new group, they have not really studied the history of it.
The Power Companies use low frequency (realtive to Broadband Frequencies) to monitor the equipment. It'll have problems just like the other did.
The lower frequencies the Power Companies use are far less lossy, far less noisy and best of all not affected by the Parallel conductor issues, which in reality being a low-pass filter actually HELPS the power companies stuff.
Being a Low-Pass Filter mean HIGH frequencies are very well attenuated.
Good luck to them.
--
[link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg],
[link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwethey
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Post #214,204
7/11/05 12:22:26 PM
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The other problem
is that every transformer in the system acts as a low pass filter. In the US, we put a stepdown transformer for something like every 4-8 houses. Retransmitters (routers, bridges, whatever you call em) are required to preserve the high freq signal across transformers. That'll be an awful lot of retransmitters.
"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" --Mark Twain
"The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them." --Albert Einstein
"This is still a dangerous world. It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mental losses." --George W. Bush
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Post #214,212
7/11/05 12:37:23 PM
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Yeah, no kidding. I wasn't even considering...
The "last mile" problems like that. That makes the possibility of success far far less likely. Period.
In theory it would be an AWESOME thing, but in reality, it is far from being even "mediocre".
--
[link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg],
[link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwethey
[image|http://www.danasoft.com/vipersig.jpg||||]
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Post #214,199
7/11/05 12:08:22 PM
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Never Happen.
Tooo many things that it'll interrupt.
Those Big long wires are Perfect Transmission Antenna.
The biggest problems are Fire, Police, Military, Air Traffic.
The biggest evil of all is the I2R losses. The impedance how ever small in the powerline, is still very large when you consider 20-100 miles of it. High-Frequency is very lossy, over small impedences over any length of wire that is parallel to the other conductor (now twisted is much better, but that leads to "power line" issues in reliability). There will be an attempt to put a "amplifier" at every few towers, but that will just exacerbate the interference.
IMNSHO, The POTS infrastructure (some being 50+ years old) is more than capable of attaining broadband capacity. There are (currently more expensive than DSL) technologies the can support 100Mbit over POTS for 10KM regardless of quality and is very reliable, as long as there is continuity. Many "circuit extenders" use thing technology.
Something else that could be VERY useful, believe it or not, ARCNET, there is a 1GB spec out the for it, to distances exceeding 100KM, with sub 10ms latency. The problem is, there is *STILL* only physical 255 nodes that can be on any given physical circuit. Looks to me like a /24 CIDR BLOCK works out near perfect. But I suggest you do not hold your breath. The one thing about ARCNET, you could use barbed wire and earth ground for the circuit iffn you *HAD* to, short term only, no really only short term as there are other factors doing that.
--
[link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg],
[link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwethey
[image|http://www.danasoft.com/vipersig.jpg||||]
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Post #214,205
7/11/05 12:24:09 PM
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Arcnet
Never even THOUGHT about arcnet for long dstances. It is amazingly robust.. Why the hell aren't phone companies using it now?
[link|http://www.runningworks.com|
] Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
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Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
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Post #214,209
7/11/05 12:33:36 PM
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Beats me.
The 1Mbit version of ARCNET works out to 18,000ft RIGHT NOW. With a bit of armtwisting, that spec even runs on twisted (or non-twisted) pairs rather nicely.
And as to why they really are not using it, Tell me, who is/was the primary vendor/inventor of it?
That is only a guess, but NIH* is a thing faced all over the world (including my little part of the world)
NIH* == Not Invented Here.
--
[link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg],
[link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ iwethey
[image|http://www.danasoft.com/vipersig.jpg||||]
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Post #214,294
7/11/05 6:16:53 PM
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These morons still don't get it.
This is a sore spot for people like myself, who understand the true interference issues this stuff has been causing ever since they implemented it.
For another side of this story, see [link|http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/HTML/plc/|this].
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