Post #20,213
12/4/01 1:59:10 PM
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A bit more than that I think...
There is no question that quality visualization helps build up reflex pathways. Certainly if you have to reason through movements you will not do them as quickly, precisely and surely as you will if you have a reflex. Furthermore mixing visualization with practice, then feeding back to visualization creates a very good feedback loop. (Indeed there is some research suggesting that this is one of the reasons people have dreams.)
Thus even if the only benefits to visualization are mental, it would be a worthwhile thing to do for atheletes.
But all of those reasons and research do nothing to suggest that there would be a gain in pure physical strength with no physical exertion. (Though the effect had been, as Ashton noted, observed before.)
Cheers,
Ben
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Post #20,276
12/4/01 10:39:09 PM
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Hm. Surely there might be a few
million $ for commercializing this --
It is after all the Holy Grail of American Merchandising: a method of decreasing weight and/or increasing muscle tone without either (a) increasing physical exertion or (b) decreasing food intake.
Visualizing a program on the TeeVee, rather like aerobics as visualized by Eric Idle -- the emcee leading the (dis)assembled couch potatoes in their visualization exercises, as across the land, Great Deeds are done (in the mind only) by millions. Do you suppose we could get Ron Popeil? Or would Paco (from Sabado Gigante) be better? --commercial breaks for McDonalds and Stouffer's every five minutes or so.
As Ashton says, Cackle Cackle Cackle ...
Regards,
Ric
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Post #20,288
12/5/01 2:20:21 AM
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Ah but you see..
Red Herring.
There is a hideous price to be paid - by Murican standards:
..not for the faint of heart, this.
..I accept no responsibility for burst aneurysms.
[you were warned]
You must Pay Attention to achieve any benefit. (No, you can't buy a surrogate to do it for you.)
See? never become popular, obviously.
The orange Cackle.. is not permitted for Tyros..
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Post #20,389
12/5/01 5:49:31 PM
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As Ashton says, not. This is useful though.
I mean, how long would you watch a show where someone was saying, "OK, raise your arms slowly, feel the exertion..."?
Bo-ring!
But, as in the example that Ashton gave, official recognition of this has immense implications for therapy. Due to injury, many people each year are put in casts, forced into bed rest, etc. Do not sneer at the value of therapies that can be used by these people to limit how much their muscles atrophy!
Cheers,
Ben
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Post #20,396
12/5/01 6:35:58 PM
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Howzabout THIS for a commercial application?
Video and sound drivers for the PC that subliminally flash suggestions:
"Imagine lifting weights",
"Visualize running a mile as fast as you can"
and such - Imagine... It could be healthy to spend as much time as possible @ the computer... I'm thinking about the implications for longer-term space flight, as well.
Bene-Gesserit exercises!
Imric's Tips for Living- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
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Post #20,403
12/5/01 8:03:23 PM
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Imric: go to your room. No supper; no joystick.
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Post #20,402
12/5/01 8:01:20 PM
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From the trenches..
You are quite right - the 'dialogue' indeed sounds the ipitome of b o r i n g. Especially written as prose.
Ex.
You might be lying on your back, relaxed. Asked to,
Notice your breathing.
Notice how your legs feel. Is there any difference in the way the heel points the foot on left or right leg. Curl the toes of the right foot downwards. Return - now just the big toe ...
Notice your breathing.
Very slowly.. rotate your head to the right. S l o w l y, so that a butterfly perched on your nose would not be scared away (!). Does this seem to occur in small-jerks? Can you find a way to move smoothly? Slower..
Notice your breathing..
Relax the jaw. As you rotate your head right, move your eyes left. Smoothly. Slower. Now let the eyes follow the head ... ...
See? Sounds, well.. And indeed there is much in the voice delivery. And timing. And there are more details explored in various motions; this is a tiny preview.
But when you eventually stand-up (and most people do not know how to do that 'with least energy, stress' etc.!) and slowly walk around: you Notice things. Cumulatively.
I think the largest buffer here is the Murican fantasy of pill pushing for every 'discomfort' - expecting instant remedy requiring 0 participation / just $. Our culture is conditioned to regard all but allopathy as quackish. We are accustomed to this so deeply - all else is easily dismissed as hogwash.
Oink,
Ashton
who treats All 'therapies' skeptically, but will suspend disbelief long enough for an honest try. YMMV with the quality of the practitioner and your effort - as ever.
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Post #20,444
12/6/01 12:35:23 AM
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Notice your breathing...zzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!
Alex
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. -- Blaise Pascal (1623-1662)
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Post #20,589
12/6/01 9:57:50 PM
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I'm not ridiculing the technique as such;
I've used a home-brewed variant of it for years, primarily just before sleeping. For me, the hard part is relaxing; what we're talking about is a variant of a whole slew of "meditation" techniques. True, allopathic medicine is seen as a short cut, and Americans tend to be really into short cuts; but things don't have to be beneficial to 100% of the individuals in the population to have some overall benefit. IOW I see: no reason this couldn't work, much experience of my own to suggest it does, and a great possible benefit from it. I was simply suggesting a spinoff; the Ronco version, as it were.
And really, consider that millions of television "viewers" take in, oh, things like Home and Garden TV, in which watching grass grow is one of the more interesting things. Golf. The shopping networks (if those people are able to make shopping fascinating -- as they apparently do -- there is no limit to what can be accomplished). My wife left for an evening out with the neighbor, and left the TV on -- HGTV is currently announcing an exciting half-hour program devoted to watching other people house hunt. And they have viewers. And advertisers. I rest my case.
As for restrictions on tyros, þbbt!
Regards,
Ric
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