Re: Even easier than that.

Post #198,018 by cwbrenn 3/11/05 8:14:09 AM Reply	Re: Even easier than that. OK, so then font handling has improved a lot. That's good to know. And the other day I found a web design app called Nvu that looks like a genuine Dreamweaver clone. Thank God. "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #198,020 by pwhysall 3/11/05 8:30:32 AM Reply	Dreamweaver? Does it still produce HTML that is an affront to all that's good, righteous and standards-compliant? Peter [link\|http://www.ubuntulinux.org\|Ubuntu Linux] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Home] Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
Post #198,023 by cwbrenn 3/11/05 8:34:22 AM Reply	Re: Dreamweaver? No, actually Dreamweaver is pretty clean these days. Not as clean as hand-crafted, but pretty darn clean. And faster than hand coding... oh so much faster... I used Dreamweaver for the Ubersoft.net redesign. The only truly awful code on my site is the banner ad/newsbox junk that the Keenspot scripts dump into my pages. "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #198,049 by drewk 3/11/05 12:07:05 PM Reply	OT: How about PageMaker? I still haven't found anything remotely close to what I could do it PageMaker in 1994. How long does it take to clone things, anyway? === Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link\|http://DocHope.com\|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats]. [link\|http://DocHope.com\|http://DocHope.com]
Post #198,050 by cwbrenn 3/11/05 12:13:26 PM Reply	Re: OT: How about PageMaker? No DTP apps for Linux? I thought they'd have at least a few by now. I guess publishing is no longer hip. Or maybe the Linux answer is "learn SGML." :) "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #198,051 by cwbrenn 3/11/05 12:16:48 PM Reply	Maybe this? [link\|http://www.scribus.org.uk\|http://www.scribus.org.uk] Looks like it has potential. "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #198,072 by folkert 3/11/05 2:19:53 PM Reply	Scribus, is vera nice . If you are into learning a few thing, give [link\|http://www.texmacs.org/index.php3\|TeXmacs] a try. I like it. It is mainly pointed at the Scientific community... But dang, it does nearly anything you want. I have yet to come into a issue it doesn't handle yet. Does Forms Really nicely too. I am not saying it is an easy application (but then Illustrator, FlashMX, Photoshop, etc, aren't either) It is just usable from a different Mindset. Scribus, is nice and easy. My wife uses it for the Church Bulletin now. Oh and of course, if you want something to contrast look at [link\|http://www.gimp.org\|The Gimp] website. Might give you some food for thought. Recently it became able to manage CMYK as layers. Have fun. Nice to see you back, at least for a while anyway. Most of the real volatile people are gone. Ross and Norm to name a couple. But we got some new ones hanging around here, which seem to fit in somehow. Cheers. -- [link\|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net\|greg], [link\|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry\|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ *i_wethey* [link\|http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=134485&cid=11233230\|"Microsoft Security" is an even better oxymoron than "Military Intelligence"] No matter how much Microsoft supporters whine about how Linux and other operating systems have just as many bugs as their operating systems do, the bottom line is that the serious, gut-wrenching problems happen on Windows, not on Linux, not on Mac OS. -- [link\|http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1622086,00.asp\|source]
Post #198,092 by drewk 3/11/05 5:17:24 PM Reply	Scribus isn't close Trying not to sound elitist here, but if you think Scribus or TeXmacs are decent replacements for PageMaker, you never spent much time with PageMaker. Either that, or I've never seen anyone use TeXmacs in a way that remotely approached what I did with PageMaker. === Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link\|http://DocHope.com\|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats]. [link\|http://DocHope.com\|http://DocHope.com]
Post #198,095 by cwbrenn 3/11/05 5:31:35 PM Reply	Re: Scribus isn't close Well what specific features of Pagemaker are you looking for? "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #198,124 by drewk 3/11/05 10:13:18 PM Reply	The basic concept PageMaker was based on the idea of physical paste-up. You grab an image or piece of text and place it. Each article is an atomic piece. Everything else I've seen starts with the idea of a single document, and you're just changing formatting. Think of using something like Word, but everything is a text box or image box. And the tools are designed to work with them that way. Also, for multiple columns you can grab the continuation widget from the bottom of one column and continue that piece of text on another page. It really addresses the difference between one person making one document, and one person assembling the output of several people into a larger work. === Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link\|http://DocHope.com\|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats]. [link\|http://DocHope.com\|http://DocHope.com]
Post #198,126 by cwbrenn 3/11/05 10:44:22 PM Reply	Re: The basic concept Scribus uses the paste-up format. As a matter of fact, one of the reviews I read on it specifically talked about how it went this route instead of using the word processor "smart typewriter" model. Scribus uses paste-up, allows you to create frames, link text between frames, handle manual kerning, handles four-color separations... it probably doesn't have every feature PageMaker has, but it's definately a DTP app instead of a word processor. Based on what I've read, mind. Haven't had a chance to play with it yet. Soon... very soon... "We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?" - Edward Young
Post #198,128 by drewk 3/11/05 11:00:19 PM Reply	I tried it briefly I tried not to give up just because it was different from PageMaker. I really wanted it to be good. I just found it too hard to do what I wanted. === Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link\|http://DocHope.com\|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats]. [link\|http://DocHope.com\|http://DocHope.com]
Post #198,232 by folkert 3/12/05 4:23:48 PM Reply	Not, too hard, differently designed. Scribus can do nearly everything I want except for Database merging integration. TeXmacs does this for me. I use TeXmacs as a text rendering tool. More a typesetting style of use. There are many many plugin/addon/templates/etc for Texmacs... it is insane the amount of customisation is available. Go look at the TeXmacs website, it is just the tip of the iceberg. Remember TeX is the basis, remember CTAN? It can do three style of "document notation" all in the same document. Or you force it to convert on saving. You can even save it any number of way as well. I don't know about you, I still have my Pagemaker v5.0 disks hanging around and still use it from time to time only because of familiarity. -- [link\|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net\|greg], [link\|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry\|REMEMBER ED CURRY!] @ *i_wethey* [link\|http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=134485&cid=11233230\|"Microsoft Security" is an even better oxymoron than "Military Intelligence"] No matter how much Microsoft supporters whine about how Linux and other operating systems have just as many bugs as their operating systems do, the bottom line is that the serious, gut-wrenching problems happen on Windows, not on Linux, not on Mac OS. -- [link\|http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1622086,00.asp\|source]

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