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New It is representative of most of the good ones
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
New Woudln't that depend on the job?
I'm sure I've mentioned before that most of what my department does is create a new form, process the input, put the results in a database, and write reports against the data. We're just automating the paperwork.

The only place performance tends to be an issue is in reporting. There, a bad query can mean the difference between two minutes to run and 2 hours to run. But even then, we "solve" the problem by installing another slave DB server and run all reports against that. It doesn't require interactive response times, and doesn't affect performance of the master DB server.

We're still early on the exponential curve, but we're still able to double our reporting capacity by throwing hardware at it for less than the cost of an entry-level programmer. We could double again twice before paying for a real DBA.

Given that, what is our company's justification for hiring people who are really good, and paying what they're worth? (Note the sound of heads bumping against the glass ceiling of what "we" are willing to pay for programmers.)
===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
New Not that often
I'd guess that in development you wind up doing a lot of repetitive work as you literally translate forms over. I'd guess that someone good would have found ways to cut out steps so that adding more pages would go faster.

Speaking of cutting out steps, good people would find ways to eliminate steps for the users, spotting more opportunities for automation. Or they might come up with useful little tools to make people's lives easier. You'd be amazed what good a creative developer can do for an organization by solving problems that they hadn't known that they had.

Conversely a bad developer creates work for everyone else around. I'm sure that you've encountered the breed.

And a second concern with reporting is what fields mean. Typically people wind up with these complex sets of fields, and complex reports against them, but the data in the database doesn't really mean what people think they do, and the reports aren't quite what people think they are. When people act on these reports, there is a risk that they don't think about there.

And a third question. How confident are you that all of your queries actually say what you think that they say? A small mistake in a query might not just make it take 2 hours instead of 2 minutes. It might make you do an extra outer join, doubling multiplying the numbers by a random factor. Have you thought about how to detect this, and would you notice?

But you're right. With how some organizations work, they make it hard for quality people to make a difference. At some point good developers have to choose to be in an environment that enables them to perform to snuff.

Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
New Getting a little uppity there, aren't you?
You'd be amazed what good a creative developer can do for an organization by solving problems that they hadn't known that they had.
What do you think, you're a business analyst now? Get back to impementing the request that's been handed down to you and let the people who understand (the) business worry about what the users need.
===

Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link|http://DocHope.com|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats].
[link|http://DocHope.com|http://DocHope.com]
New See what I said about "some organizations"
I'm lucky enough to work in one that doesn't get in my way.

Here's how it works out.

From time to time I need a break from what I'm doing. So I take one. In those breaks I'm likely to talk to other people. Sometimes they are doing something that I know could be done better.

If I feel like it and I think that I could improve their lives in under an hour, sometimes I'll just do it. Good for morale, leaves me feeling happy, and the extra energy it leaves me generally makes up for the time spent. If I'm not feeling quite that inspired, or it is bigger, I'll tell them, "You know, it would be easier if we just had a tool to do X. It would take me about Y effort to do. I'd suggest talking to Z, tell them my estimate, and have them prioritize that project and get it in the queue."

I don't do this that often, but often enough that it makes a difference. Sometimes a big one.

Cheers,
Ben
I have come to believe that idealism without discipline is a quick road to disaster, while discipline without idealism is pointless. -- Aaron Ward (my brother)
New tiger teams, had the fortune to work on one once
given the resposability set to do A then as long as A was covered we could screw around with B,C to Z. A never got boring, a lot of pieces of the org got helped by our "submarine projects" and no one ever questioned what we were up to. Unfortunately most orgs dont recognise the value such teams ad and as soon as a merkin borg politikal CFO was merged into the company he quickly fscked the idea.
regards,
daemon
I love her dearly, far beyond any creature I've ever known, and I can prove it, for never once in almost seventy years of married life have I taken her by the throat. Mind you, it's been a near thing once or twice.
George Macdonald Frasier
Clearwater highschool marching band [link|http://www.chstornadoband.org/|http://www.chstornadoband.org/]
New Same thing where I work.
Regards,

-scott anderson

"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
New That's actually my "non-break" job
I'm responsible to discover where IS/IT can make people's jobs easier before the people themselves figure it out. Not quite Management By Walking Around, but close--more Watching People Work.
     Newbie - (bionerd) - (94)
         Welcome. - (pwhysall)
         Michigan? On the convoy route? - (drewk) - (48)
             Re: Michigan? On the convoy route? - (bionerd) - (47)
                 He's referring to BeeP bash - (broomberg) - (1)
                     Re: He's referring to BeeP bash - (bionerd)
                 That's a curious thing to say - (drewk) - (17)
                     Re: That's a curious thing to say - (bionerd)
                     Probably means that we don't do actual (real) work. :-) -NT - (ChrisR)
                     That's sad Drook - (broomberg) - (9)
                         I said 90% didn't I? - (drewk) - (8)
                             It is representative of most of the good ones -NT - (ben_tilly) - (7)
                                 Woudln't that depend on the job? - (drewk) - (6)
                                     Not that often - (ben_tilly) - (5)
                                         Getting a little uppity there, aren't you? - (drewk) - (4)
                                             See what I said about "some organizations" - (ben_tilly) - (3)
                                                 tiger teams, had the fortune to work on one once - (daemon)
                                                 Same thing where I work. -NT - (admin)
                                                 That's actually my "non-break" job - (FuManChu)
                     Programming is working with abstractions. - (Andrew Grygus) - (1)
                         Okay, at that level I see what you mean -NT - (drewk)
                     Excuse me - (tuberculosis) - (2)
                         Since my explanation in the thread didn't clear this up ... - (drewk) - (1)
                             Because creative \\= abstract - (jake123)
                 Programmers, eh? - (pwhysall) - (14)
                     Where's my soldering iron? - (ChrisR) - (13)
                         Which cable, the power or the ribbon? -NT - (drewk) - (12)
                             All of 'em at once. - (ChrisR) - (11)
                                 Quit before the magic smoke comes out though. Can be tricky. -NT - (Another Scott) - (2)
                                     Networking engineering requires a good sense of smell. -NT - (ChrisR) - (1)
                                         ICLRPD (new thread) - (FuManChu)
                                 Hey! That's my specialty! - (ben_tilly) - (7)
                                     Have you ever blown an inch-wide hole out of a power supply? -NT - (inthane-chan) - (6)
                                         Have you ever shorted across the 220 supply with an ohmeter? -NT - (drewk) - (5)
                                             Nope. - (inthane-chan) - (4)
                                                 I helped blow out half of downtown Palm Springs once - (drewk) - (3)
                                                     Funniest one here . . . - (Andrew Grygus) - (2)
                                                         Do we know Trudy under another name? -NT - (ben_tilly) - (1)
                                                             No. - (Andrew Grygus)
                 I'm no programmer either - (bepatient) - (2)
                     Weren't you working on changing that state of affairs? -NT - (FuManChu) - (1)
                         Was thinking about it. - (bepatient)
                 Don't you need abstract thinking in biology? -NT - (Arkadiy) - (8)
                     Re: Don't you need abstract thinking in biology? - (bionerd) - (7)
                         So, can you tell us about your typical time at work? - (Arkadiy) - (6)
                             I thought... - (pwhysall) - (1)
                                 Don't forget the biscuits - (drewk)
                             Do you really want to hear about this? - (bionerd) - (3)
                                 Suggestion - (drewk) - (2)
                                     Been there, done that - (bionerd)
                                     I don't imagine she got where she is... - (Steven A S)
         Welcome - (broomberg) - (25)
             Re: Welcome - (bionerd) - (24)
                 He has past cause... - (ben_tilly) - (23)
                     No I'm not him...I'm a her - (bionerd) - (21)
                         Cool, there is a slight imbalance in these parts.. -NT - (ben_tilly)
                         Men are parasites ;-) - (ben_tilly) - (19)
                             Re: Men are parasites ;-) - (bionerd) - (18)
                                 Why expend more energy? To get more kids. - (ben_tilly) - (17)
                                     A couple of reasons. - (Andrew Grygus) - (15)
                                         Second point is pretty much pure circular reasoning, AFAICS. - (CRConrad) - (2)
                                             We are not talking 'fair' here, we're talking 'survival'. - (Andrew Grygus)
                                             Nature is not PC - (ben_tilly)
                                         Let me address those reasons for strict sexuality - (ben_tilly) - (11)
                                             well if I were a hermaphrodyte I would never leave the house - (daemon) - (10)
                                                 Don't confuse "hermaphroditic" with "flexible"... -NT - (admin)
                                                 It works for nematodes - (ben_tilly) - (8)
                                                     Y'all take all the mystery out of procreation - (ChrisR) - (6)
                                                         Out drinking? Reading Jung? Casting a horoscope? -NT - (ben_tilly)
                                                         OT: Where TH is Ross anyway? -NT - (mmoffitt) - (3)
                                                             Re: OT: Where TH is Ross anyway? - (Yendor) - (1)
                                                                 Ah. Thanks. Missed that. -NT - (mmoffitt)
                                                             Atlanta, IIRC. ... Oh, you mean. Well, he ran away. :-( -NT - (Another Scott)
                                                         I agree - (Nightowl)
                                                     dont have to try, they fight real well (bull sealions) - (daemon)
                                     Exactly -NT - (bionerd)
                     Re: He has past cause... - (Nightowl)
         Hoy - (admin) - (4)
             Ann Arbor- Heck , no! - (bionerd) - (3)
                 My sister went there for a few years. - (admin) - (1)
                     Cow Tipping- - (bionerd)
                 Moo U - (tuberculosis)
         Use Debian - (lincoln)
         welcome, another expert to opine with :-) -NT - (daemon)
         With a handle like "bionerd"... - (FuManChu) - (7)
             My score - (bionerd) - (6)
                 Meh, amateur... - (admin) - (4)
                     Wait until you know me better before calling me an amateur - (bionerd) - (3)
                         Amateur. Raw, rank, unadulterated. - (admin) - (2)
                             Nerd God - (bionerd) - (1)
                                 Yes. -NT - (admin)
                 Your Overlord speaks: - (folkert)
         welcome to the party -NT - (cforde)
         Welcome from another non-IT - (Ashton)
         Welcome! - (jb4)

How can he be so skinny and live SO phat?!?
220 ms