Nice change of direction there....

Post #19,146 by bepatient 11/21/01 2:06:25 PM Reply	Nice change of direction there.... won't work. We directed this >campaign< at Al-Qaida, ObL and the regime that harbored them...after they were given an ultimatum to turn him over and open their camps to inspection. They refused. We've been told all along that this is not the only campaign that will be fought in the war on terrorism. So... (ouch...sometimes hanging as far right as required here for balance >is< actually painful) As for your 2 other questions...well its obvious we won't be bombing ourselves anytime soon (although if ground troops enter in..we just might with "friendly fire") And 2...it is imperative that we re-evaluate our position wrt Israel...and its something that I don't think will happen in any real fashion...which means that we will LOSE this "war against terrorism"...because we will continue to battle the symptoms and not the root causes...which are largely our continued support of Israeli aggression and our oil dependency. You were born...and so you're free...so Happy Birthday! _{Laurie Anderson} [link\|mailto:bepatient@aol.com\|BePatient]
Post #19,151 by Arkadiy 11/21/01 2:15:53 PM Reply	Oh, don't worry... Our position towards Israel is already very different. We _will_ shoehorn them into the territory that we think is appropriate. Don't you see all the pressure now? THEN we will have a real problem: what to do when that does not help, and halved Israel is still hated as much as before? P.S. Bin Laden won this particular round: if you hit US hard enough, it will change policy.
Post #19,152 by Arkadiy 11/21/01 2:17:29 PM Reply	Oil almost forgot... The war tax money in this war should be directed towards energy research. But, since we have a war tax breaks instead of war taxes, guess what will happen to the research...
Post #19,154 by TTC 11/21/01 2:33:09 PM Reply	Re: Nice change of direction there.... I'm not sure you have to play devil's advocate for the far right. >We directed this >campaign< at Al-Qaida, ObL and the regime that harbored them...after they were given an ultimatum to turn him over and open their camps to inspection. Let me repeat what has been repeated many times. Ultimatum issued without proof being presented, then and now. And it's NOT the CAMPAIGN against terrorists that's drawing the criticisms. It's the way the US has once again shown that it has no regard for anything but "American" justice. You mentioned in a few of your previous posts that the reason that proofs were not presented was because it would be ignored and risk tactical advantage. What exactly has been accomplished by the American bombing? Nothing except that Afghanistan now has a "new" ruling regime, and more "mines" (duds and such) and more civilians dead/dying. What tangible advantage does it have against OBL and his terrorist group after all these bombing? Not to say that the US has once again put itself in a very fragile position, [link\|http://www.gallup-international.com/terrorismpoll_figures.htm\|world opinion] wise.
Post #19,163 by Arkadiy 11/21/01 3:41:55 PM Reply	Proof Two things do not seem to be in dispute. One, bin Laden said many times that he is at war with America. Two, bin Laden is a head of a terrorist group. Therefore, if US declares a war on terrorism, bin Laden is a target. If you have him in your "custody" and protect him, you place yourself at war with America. This is not justice, "American" or otherwise. This is not a criminal investigation. This is war. >What tangible advantage does it have against OBL and his terrorist group after all these bombing? If you still can't discern what advantages in the war on bin Laden we gained by helping Northern Aliance, I have to doubt your mental capabilities. Or your honesty.
Post #19,198 by TTC 11/21/01 11:36:17 PM Reply	Re: Proof >Therefore, if US declares a war on terrorism, bin Laden is a target. No dispute there. But you sure it's a war on terrorism OR a war on terrorism AGAINST the US? BIG difference. >If you have him in your "custody" and protect him, you place yourself at war with America. This is not justice, "American" or otherwise. This is not a criminal investigation. This is war. So when can we expect the Pentagon to announce the SOA/CIA/Pentagon/White House heads as target? When can we expect the US to start bombing the country that have them in its custody and protection? Remember you said this is war. If you can't see the hyprocracy in the "War on Terrorism", and the double standards, then I really have to question your mentality or your honesty. Just look at the Taliban. How organized are they? What have OBL and his group lost? State of the arts weaponary support from Taliban? Enormous cash influx from the Taliban? Political clout from being associated with the Taliban? Or their precious caves in Afghanistan? Seriously, enlighten me. To quote Ashton, "Sheesh!"

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