You deliberately misunderstand, because you know you've lost

Post #18,758 by marlowe 11/19/01 10:43:51 AM Reply	You deliberately misunderstand, because you know you've lost I didn't put "fair trial" in quotes for the fun of it. And there was no mistaking my intent, except on purpose. And by the way, it was you, not I, who insinuated that military tribunals are less just just than civilian, in that rant of yours. Brandioch, not only haven't you got a case, but you haven't got the courtesy to admit it. All you can do is twist your opponent's words. Shame on you. By resorting to these tactics, and so early, you have demonstrated that you are defeated. You've lost. But you haven't the grace to admit it. No wonder you're so enamored of relativism. It's the perfect cover for those who can't defend their opinions on merit. [link\|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html\|http://www.angelfir...e/index.html] Sometimes "tolerance" is just a word for not dealing with things.
Post #18,761 by Brandioch 11/19/01 11:06:54 AM Reply	Maybe you have a problem understanding me? "And by the way, it was you, not I, who insinuated that military tribunals are less just just than civilian, in that rant of yours." Note the use of the word "secret" that you keep skipping over. A "secret" military tribunal may be as "just" as an open civilian trial. BUT YOU WILL NEVER KNOW. "Brandioch, not only haven't you got a case, but you haven't got the courtesy to admit it." No. Unlike you, I do not blindly accept that the government has my best interests at heart. Nor do I trust that it is "just" or "fair" or anything else. Unlike you, I know there is a reason why we have public trials in this country. "All you can do is twist your opponent's words." What I'm doing is asking you if you believe what you're saying. Simply tell me that you trust the government to operate in secret in the best interests of the citizens. Just do that. And I will tell you about certain drug operations our government engaged in to fund certain illegal operations in another country. Or maybe I'll tell you about certain weapons deals our government has made. Or maybe I'll tell you about government experiments on military personnel. "By resorting to these tactics, and so early, you have demonstrated that you are defeated." That's right. Keep telling me I'm defeated because you know that the government has NOT acted in the best interests of the citizens before AND that these actions are done IN SECRET. Then tell me that the government NEEDS to do MORE in SECRET to "protect" the citizens. "It's the perfect cover for those who can't defend their opinions on merit." Whatever. Keep believing in the all caring, completely trustworthy government that will continue to conduct operations in secret. Simply put, I don't trust the government to handle this in secret AND You do trust the government to handle this in secret. Denial is just a river to you. For your information, the Nuremburg trials are publicly available. Not secret. But that doesn't matter to you because you trust the government to operate in secret.
Post #18,877 by Ashton 11/19/01 8:02:56 PM Reply	Ah.. I begin to understand your larger problem. Every thread is an opportunity for You to Win .. some Brownie points? - via duelling factoids. And your faith in your own Challenger status is.. er fetching and touching. (I suspect we might not agree very closely with the idea that there are very few.. relevant 'facts': where any issue devolves to that of characterizing motives - in homo-saps at play, especially homo-saps obsessed with a weird notion of Winning something?) Lost. Won. Defeated. All life as chess match for the Master Logician-in-training. No wonder your essays so often fail to convince - the aim is to Win, not illuminate. Possibly the Chess mindset run amok, then? But you have lots of company - 'Win' is the bizness motto too: never mind at what cost to both language and society. Why, Life for you must be just On Big Game of Football (for those not amenable to Chess Victory) - One Wins All / All the Rest Lose All. a==b, b==a via Commutative Law. {sigh} The trouble in this thread is: even the idea of 'justice' is unalloyed metaphor, like virtually evey concept created in minds - dependent on 'very much which must go well'. There is NO Known guarantor of 'justice' yet devised IMhO. And no amount of marshalled (or court-martialled) factoids can ever be assembled - but that these are variously selected for effect. (From time-limit to endlessly introducing lesser and lesser-relevant factoids? for at least One thing) Brandioch recited from actual experience, an ~ source for his reservations re UCMJ. Note: these do not constitute 'proof' of anything; nor could a 50x compilation produce proof - either. Nor did he suggest this lived experience as constituting any sort of 'proof' of anything. Just background for an opinion on a matter as complex as any we homo-saps are always conceiving. Simply - you appear to desire nice Fact/Wars Wins/Losses, preferably from some hierarchy of Authority (blessing the factoids as True 'facts' at some level, perhaps?). No wonder your reading of replies is filtered so precisely: if it ain't Authorized Fact - it is meaningless gibberish. To you. I shall try to tailor responses to you accordingly, if it seems worth the effort to try. A Fact-Win is sorta trivial though, isn't it? Beryllium's At. Wt. is 9.02. No! it is 9.013 per >1952 determination. Oh. Ashton Dear Lord, please protect me from the wrath of those who Know.

Welcome to IWETHEY!