Post #172,312
9/1/04 10:59:08 PM
|
Tried an experiment...shocked at the results
Okay, we wondered if maybe Nikolai was heating up because I was copying and pasting huge amounts of text from the internet to Word, creating basically 200+ page documents of text.
I spent all day with him on today, temp never went above 90.
I experimented tonight by doing a copy and paste of ONE 200+ page document. First three, temp didn't move much. Then the temperature in Zone 2 went up 2 degrees every capture or so (capturing 30 posts at a time).
In 12 minutes, I created one 226 page Word document, and the temperature had risen from 88-104.
I stopped capturing, temp cooled down rapidly and is now back at 90.
What gives? Someone suggested that it was the RAM heating up, because they said RAM was the main thing used in copying and pasting. Is it really possible that he's only heating up because of this process I've been doing?
I wouldn't have believed it was really archiving my group 30 posts at a time that was causing this, but now I'm starting to believe it really is.
Any thoughts on this? And does it mean something is still wrong, or am I pushing the limits of my computer somehow?
Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
|
Post #172,314
9/1/04 11:03:29 PM
|
Processor usage
Processors get hot when they work hard. My laptop fan comes on when for example playing a video.
Just jack the ranges up in the BIOS. You can't make it commit suicide.
-drl
|
Post #172,316
9/1/04 11:07:34 PM
|
Re: Processor usage
Thanks Ross :)
We'd rather not jack up the Bioses, instead I'm gonna try the same experiment with a fan blowing at the open computer.
Nice to know I'm almost at the solution though.
Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
|
Post #172,318
9/1/04 11:13:58 PM
|
Re: Processor usage
Pardon me, but that's a dumb idea. Make the machine live within its own limits. That's WHY the ranges are adjustable!
Moreover, I would still replace the processor fan AS A MATTER OF COURSE every year for a fast processor. They use these weird little motors that can fibrillate when dust gets in them, and you can't get the dust out by blowing on it.
-drl
|
Post #172,320
9/1/04 11:28:10 PM
|
Re: Processor usage
I don't even know it's acceptable limits yet, I couldn't even find fan speeds for it.
Bottom line though, I only need to archive 6000 or so more posts, so if this works as a temp solution, I don't see the need for a permanent one unless there is really something wrong.
The entire computer, including all the fans, is only 1 year, 4 months and 1 day old, would you still replace the processor fan if it was that new? Just curious.
I never had this problem till I started copying all this data 30 posts at a time, not even when I stayed online all day.
I'm considering all solutions, and John is too, but right now it seems if I archive the posts with the fan on high aimed at the open computer, it doesn't go as high as quickly. And I can't fix it tonight, so it's a temporary fix, for tonight anyway.
I do appreciate your input, Ross, I just can't make decisions on how to fix it, John does that. And he isn't implementing any serious repairs till he gives it a thorough cleaning on the weekend. We're gonna look into it in more depth then.
I'll pass your opinions to him though. :) Thanks.
Brenda
Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
|
Post #172,321
9/1/04 11:33:36 PM
|
Re: Processor usage
Repeat: Processor fans are cranky - they use a kind of brushless motor that can fibrillate (not spin, just shake) when the bearing gets dusty and resistant to turning.
Repeat: The temperature ranges in the BIOS are such that you CAN'T destroy your processor unless you turn off the sensors completely and use a broken fan. There are these nice guys and gals known as "engineers" who figure this stuff out for you. Blowing on the box with a Walmart fan was never part of their design.
You seem not to understand - the processor is going to get hot when it's stressed by an intensive computing job. So what you need to do is make your computer live with its hot processor AFTER taking the precaution that the processor fan is in good shape. Once a fan has begun fibrillating you CAN'T FIX IT by blowing on it. You need to buy a NEW FAN - it's only 10 bucks fer chrissake!
-drl
|
Post #172,323
9/1/04 11:39:58 PM
9/1/04 11:47:48 PM
|
Okay, I told him
Repeat: Processor fans are cranky - they use a kind of brushless motor that can fibrillate (not spin, just shake) when the bearing gets dusty and resistant to turning. Okay, John said he plans to check the fans out more this weekend, that's only a day or so away. Edit: John just also told me that to make sure the Processor fan was spinning and not fibrillating, he put his finger in the fan and felt the blade hit his fingernail. He said the blade hit his fingernail and he could tell it was spinning that way. (I knew he did something cause I heard a funny noise and he jerked back, but I hadn't known what he did). Repeat: The temperature ranges in the BIOS are such that you CAN'T destroy your processor unless you turn off the sensors completely and use a broken fan. There are these nice guys and gals known as "engineers" who figure this stuff out for you. Blowing on the box with a Walmart fan was never part of their design. He doesn't know if the BIOS will adjust the fan speeds for him, but he's gonna look into that this weekend too. He said he needs to research into what the safe speeds should be or are, or something like that. You seem not to understand - the processor is going to get hot when it's stressed by an intensive computing job. So what you need to do is make your computer live with its hot processor AFTER taking the precaution that the processor fan is in good shape. Once a fan has begun fibrillating you CAN'T FIX IT by blowing on it. You need to buy a NEW FAN - it's only 10 bucks fer chrissake! I hear you loud and clear, we just can't do it till the weekend, if we determine it needs replacing. so meanwhile, to be careful and get some of the archiving done, I'm using the Walgreens fan to blow on it and keep it a little cooler and archiving one just one file at a time, then letting it rest again before archiving another, so it's cool again. Question: Would a fibrillating fan make a scritchy sound like someone scratching something on metal? My computer makes that noise very intermittently and it sounds like, well, best description I can give you, is it sounds like when my car engine fan blades were scraping against some metal thingy that got bent into the blade path. Is that a sound it might make? What we also want to do is find the speed the fan is set at and SHOULD be running at, and then see if the speed matches what it should be, so we can determine if all the fans are ok, or what ones need replacing. I'm not trying to be stubborn, Ross, like I said, we can't do anything intense to it like that till he's off work and has time to research stuff like temps required and fan speeds. I've looked for some of the info, but I can't seem to find it all. And at least I've determined it only does it while archiving, so I know now not to archive for hours on end without breaks. Brenda Edit: fixed grammar and P.S. John also turned off spell checker and grammar checker and stuff on Word to see if that makes it work a little less harder. I don't want these documents altered by spell check or anything anyway.
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
Edited by Nightowl
Sept. 1, 2004, 11:42:21 PM EDT
Edited by Nightowl
Sept. 1, 2004, 11:47:48 PM EDT
|
Post #172,331
9/2/04 12:15:40 AM
|
Re: Okay, I told him
(slaps head)
The fibrillation can happen any time, as when -GASP- it gets hot because the processor it's sitting on heats up. If it never happened until now, and knowing the dust situation in St. Louis, I'd immediately suspect the fan and replace it REGARDLESS of other considerations.
-drl
|
Post #172,334
9/2/04 12:19:02 AM
|
I see
so it wouldn't fibrillate all the time then? It could spin properly sometimes and then not spin properly. Okay, noted.
Would it make that weird scritching sound?
I'll let him know what you said, and I really do appreciate the input.
Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
|
Post #172,335
9/2/04 12:19:36 AM
|
Don't know about that
-drl
|
Post #172,338
9/2/04 12:23:08 AM
|
Clean the crap off the leading edges of the fan blades.
Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
|
Post #172,342
9/2/04 12:27:57 AM
|
Will do, Peter
We're gonna unhook him and clean him thoroughly this weekend, I'll tell John to clean the blades too. :)
Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
|
Post #172,328
9/2/04 12:02:51 AM
|
You'd be surprised at what makes a CPU get hot.
I had a bizarre situation the other week here at work. Acrobat was hanging partway through a document export on a user's PC. As it progressed through the document - and it was over 200 pages, too - the fan on the CPU could be heard to get louder and louder. By the time it reached it's hang point, the fan was going full-bore. And it stayed that way until the Acrobat process was killed.
(And the problem? Acrobat needs the screen at 1024x768 or higher. Don't know why except that at 800x600, it hangs partway through. Always the same spot, too.)
Wade.
Is it enough to love
Is it enough to breathe
Somebody rip my heart out
And leave me here to bleed
| |
Is it enough to die
Somebody save my life
I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary
Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
|
Post #172,329
9/2/04 12:09:14 AM
|
2nd experiment, amazing results!
John turned off spell checker and grammar checker on Word.
I archived another 200+ page file, no extra Walgreens fan blowing on the open computer.
Temp in Zone 2 never went above 90.
Wow.....
I know it's still not a permanent fix, but it's good enough for me to feel safe archiving the rest of the group, as long as I take a break between each file.
John said the processes of checking every post and word and grammar was probably what was taking most of the extra the CPU power, and it looks like he was right. And I don't want to alter my group anyway, I want it exactly like it was originally posted, so I need no spell/grammar check on it.
Still gonna give Nikolai a full cleaning and check over on the weekend though.
Thanks for everyone's input, it's nice at least to know what's causing it, and that I have ways to control how hot it gets even temporarily.
Nightowl >8#
"A determined soul will do more with a rusty monkey wrench than a loafer will accomplish with all the tools in a machine shop." -- Robert Hughes, Australian Art Critic, Writer
|
Post #172,385
9/2/04 9:47:31 AM
|
Real world physics intrude in our digital fancies
How dare they! We just got a perfect world going here.
Ashton, vindicated.
--
I love the accent: \ufffdMedicine Square Godden.\ufffd
-- [link|http://www.lileks.com/bleats/archive/04/0804/083104.html|James Lileks]
|
