Re: Joseph Campbell also liked 113

Post #16,560 by Ashton 11/5/01 7:23:10 AM Reply	Re: Joseph Campbell also liked 113 I'm familiar with JC (er.. Jos. Campbell too ;-) Not sure if you see the implications, since you appear surprised at both Campbell's view and that of the 'most people'. By most people - I will presume too, that you mean literalists / Fundamentalists (?) since from that POV: it is unfathomable; opposes all their castles in the air and the contents of those castles. Simply read those words with comprehension. What else are they saying than ~~ a stark statement that this 'Kingdom' is not of space or time: with massive inferences for those who become bogged down in history, translations, 'bodies' and literal interpretations of all those metaphors. No 'place' is needed, nor past/present/future (human concepts all). I think you'll find that the esoteric wings of Christian sects (Jesuits for one, at the top of the hierarchy) share with the same wing of most other - even Corporate - religions, such a view of "It All". The Bible, like many equivalents in the world - tries to cover all bets; simplistic homilies for beginners and hints for the advanced - who ~grok the 'nontemporality' idea and wish to know more. Those who see the parables as Sufi sayings (!) and understand what a metaphor is: will read a quite different book from what the literalist reads and embellishes from imagination. Which is perhaps why all the wars start - either internecine ones, sect <> sect, or on through swords and stuff. Only the simple-minded find excuses for wars in these common human documents. Those who actually want to know - are aware of the limitations of language and don't give a Damn about the angels dancing on pins / all the other contradictory material [except for the fun of argument, that is: See Monty-P - The Holy Grail, etc]. :-\ufffd Anyway - not merely insignificant-I, but many others see this exact 3-sentence-sentence - as encapsulating that common Truth which defies simplistic deconstruction into bite-sized slogans. (Never mind the Xian hubris of imagining theirs the Only Truth - or even that they found it first! .. and all the usual tribal BS) It's a gem, wherever found. Pity there's so much scabrous nonsense fore and aft -- with merely the occasional jewel left unedited or expanded into meaninglessness. Screw the apocalyptic folk! Apoplexy is what they yearn for - let them enjoy their delicious waiting .. Of Course "they don't get it" ! For all mentioned reasons. IMhO you cannot 'explain' these 3 sentences to a retard; it just won't happen. You have to find out a lot - and then dismiss that all! before you can get close.. how about calling it a most difficult Simplicity? Hang in there. The Cosmic humor seems most evident: in the amount of adulterated BS you have to wade through then ignore!, before ever even getting close to, what must be ultimate Simplicity. (For penultimate humor, add in especially the conundrum: I Know.. and I'll Tell You !!) as in.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. Cackle.. As God 'says' I Am What I Am
Post #16,569 by brettj 11/5/01 8:34:22 AM Reply	Now I understand Th 1:2 & 3 >>>> "IMhO you cannot 'explain' these 3 sentences to a retard; it just won't happen. You have to find out a lot - and then dismiss that all! before you can get close.. how about calling it a most difficult Simplicity?" <<<< That helps me to understand Thomas 1:2 better. Thanks. 2) Jesus said, "Let him who seeks continue seeking until he finds. When he finds, he will become troubled. When he becomes troubled, he will be astonished, and he will rule over the All." 3) Jesus said, "If those who lead you say, 'See, the Kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they say to you, 'It is in the sea,' then the fish will precede you. Rather, the Kingdom is inside of you, and it is outside of you. When you come to know yourselves, then you will become known, and you will realize that it is you who are the sons of the living Father. But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty." P.S. Yes, I am fairly astonished by all that I am learning in the past few years since my studies of multiple religions began. I ran across Joseph Campbell from his video interviews with Bill Moyer. He was the one that got me interested in the many religions, or as he called them, the masks of God. His "Hero" video was also quite enlightening.
Post #16,647 by Ashton 11/5/01 3:31:12 PM Reply	He obviously loved his work and his scholarship speaks for itself, along with his clear effort not to latch-on to some EZ 'solution for all'.. No one can say 'what he realized', of course, just as with any other person. But he wasn't selling anything! and I think that's evidence that he really did grok the humor and saw why it didn't much matter - which metaphor you decide to focus on, so long as you didn't start to build a model-Edifice.. around it and begin renting space in it. :-\ufffd Believe the other verses you quote are as apt as any that are around re astonishment - what else is an appropriate response to just noticing the Mystery of umm I Am, as that filters in from sleep, each AM (or PM - depending on your hours ;-)? Many have noted even the astonishing-humor of ~ 'seeking' that which already you 'possess', but just haven't noticed. Enjoy the process; it seems that no two are the same and there's never an EOF (except for the Model-builders: then you Know they got it screwed up) Cheers, Ashton still dismantling dead ones; it's sometimes a start - beats owl-entrails.

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