Forced to use A to get B? Tsk tsk tsk. How MS of them.

Post #156,440 by tablizer 5/22/04 7:44:37 PM Reply	Forced to use A to get B? Tsk tsk tsk. How MS of them. ________________ oop.ismad.com
Post #156,441 by admin 5/22/04 7:46:46 PM Reply	You miss the point, anyway. HQL can be used against any database engine. Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #156,451 by tablizer 5/22/04 9:17:03 PM Reply	I am not necessarily disagreeing with that here I am only saying that a better and/or vender-neutral query language/system is or can be orthogonal to O-R mappers. ________________ oop.ismad.com
Post #156,455 by admin 5/22/04 9:49:59 PM Reply	Re: I am not necessarily disagreeing with that here At this point, it is not orthogonal. It exists for Hibernate, and it was easy to write because of OO. If you disagree, prove me wrong. Otherwise concede the point. Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #156,461 by tablizer 5/23/04 12:08:31 AM 5/23/04 12:10:06 AM Reply	not my burden of evidence It exists for Hibernate, and it was easy to write because of OO. If you disagree, prove me wrong. Otherwise concede the point. By "easy to write", do you mean using the framework or making the framework? You have the burden of showing something being "easy". Remember: "Equal, subjective, or unknown until proven otherwise". I can accept that my preferences may be purely a subjective mindfit. If you believe OO is some universal truth and/or a slum-dunk improvement, then it is your burden to show it. ________________ oop.ismad.com Edited by tablizer May 23, 2004, 12:10:06 AM EDT Expand All History
Post #156,464 by admin 5/23/04 12:37:46 AM Reply	Wrong. Hibernate exists. Your mythical über SQL doesn't. If your version is even as good, let alone better, then you need to show it. Otherwise it's vaporware. Now go answer or concede the other points. Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #156,468 by tablizer 5/23/04 12:56:18 AM Reply	exist != good Hibernate exists. Your mythical \ufffdber SQL doesn't. If your version is even as good, let alone better, then you need to show it. Otherwise it's vaporware. Mere existence does not necessarily lead to goodness. You need to explain why it is so good using code. Show me something that procedural or raw SQL MUST result in a mess with. Nor am I going to compete with an army of programmers to build a clone of Hibernate all by myself. That is not a realistic request. I can perhaps show specific aspects though. And being DB-neutral is moot because you are tied to Hibernate in a similar way. You are applying a double-standard. ________________ oop.ismad.com
Post #156,469 by ChrisR 5/23/04 1:00:41 AM Reply	Existence beats Non-Existence
Post #156,486 by admin 5/23/04 9:29:00 AM Reply	I've already shown you. Go answer or concede the other points. Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #156,491 by FuManChu 5/23/04 10:21:45 AM Reply	Hm. So I can make any claim and force you to prove me wrong? You started this debate with some wild claims. Are you saying now "that was just subjective?" Remember: "Equal, subjective, or unknown until proven otherwise". Nice ideal. But they're in reverse order. If you want your claims to move from unknown/subjective to equal, the burden is on you. That's life. Suck it up.
Post #156,493 by admin 5/23/04 10:52:58 AM 5/23/04 10:53:33 AM Reply	Actually, what he said was: "You spend all your code translating back and forth between two discordant paradigms." So he made a very specific claim in this instance. ;-) Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..." Edited by admin May 23, 2004, 10:53:33 AM EDT Expand All History

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