Re: You're only looking at the bad.

In the last hundred years, we've completely changed everything ABOUT the human social interactions. The "old ways" wouldn't have worked.

No kidding. That was my point. Inthane was talking about the safety net having leaks and I was just point out that the leaks in the net are more fundamental than government programs missing a few people

So all the Jay's Church have a safety net, but Addison's Church (cause we're all poor) don't?

The poor churches I've attended tended to be far closer nit and better at helping each other out than the rich churches.

A few years back, a church my mother was attending ...

Which is totally irrelevant to the situation but...everyone has an antecdote

Mine is that I spent the first 6 months of my Chirstian life attending a mostly rich white Megachurch on Sunday mornings and an almost all black,poor, pentecostal church on Saturday nights and between the two of them I learned what community was all about.

You're looking at the church; I'm looking at the church as an example of a community that supports each other. Religion doesn't matter, but in our country that religion used to embody that community at some level and we've losed that community and whether you replace it with religion or some other purpose for people to come together, we are far weaker without something that does hold us together

That was my point. Inthane was talking about the safety net having leaks and I was just point out that the leaks in the net are more fundamental than government programs missing a few people

I don't want to say "That's not your point" but I don't think I read you as saying that.

Neither do I want to completely disagree. But your tone is one that religion and community were "kicked out" of modern life, and that I don't think is the case at all. I think its much more of a case that people have gotten lazy, and self-protective, and as a result have stopped having the community.

Look at the huge subdivisions, where nobody has room for even throwing a baseball, much less the kids getting a game up. That's not forced on people, they're choosing it.

And so I agree about the loss of community. I even agree some on that the community is also sometimes centered around religion. I just don't think that's a good focal point - when you have a problem with the focal point, the minister runs off with the till, or anything, its doubly worse... But that's a minor point.

My take on religion was more in reply to your other post, that that would be your answer.

The poor churches I've attended tended to be far closer nit and better at helping each other out than the rich churches.

Funny how that is, isn't it?

You're right, of course, but I was talking more in generalities - the problem with "churches" is that they're of course inclusive, and of something that (obviously) is of great debate.

I'm looking at the church as an example of a community that supports each other.

That's true (for the purposes of this discussion), but what do you do for members who don't want to belong in your church, or you don't want in them?

Religion doesn't matter, but in our country that religion used to embody that community at some level

But I disagree here - religion does matter - does to you, see your prior post. The people who want a religious solution, or partial solution are presuming (from what I see) that everybody will agree with them... Its what do you do with the people who *don't* that's a big issue there.

And the community is more a issue of size.. Small towns are still pretty closely knit.. We've spread out - notice your commute :) - and as a result, spread ourselves thinly - not allowing the time it takes for community.

Addison

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