Ouch.

Post #359,004 by Another Scott 6/16/12 11:51:47 AM Reply	Ouch. We just got our bills for last month - it's just the two of us, and we don't work at home. Gas: $36.54 (water heater) - 20.3 therms Electric: $125.60 (14 SEER central A/C) - 1056 kWh Our electric bill is rarely over $200, but is highest in August (1973 kWh last August). Gas is much higher in the winter - we used 176 therms in January ("94% efficient" gas furnace). J has some relatives in Texas that pay over $1k per month for electricity. :-/ Hang in there. Good luck.
Post #359,017 by boxley 6/16/12 4:24:22 PM Reply	I run 350 balanced electric and gas year round. High electric in the summer but the a/c heats the gas hotwater heater so gas is only $32 in the summer Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
Post #359,019 by Andrew Grygus 6/16/12 7:29:35 PM Reply	Well, I'm pretty sloppy about energy . . . . . . still mostly incandescent, 200-Watt per fixture (though I'm rapidly converting then all to mini-candelabra halogens - still 200-Watt). I've got at least 3 older desktop computers running 24-7 with no sleep mode. And, of course, there are printers, copying machine and fax, but most of those have sleep mode. My water heating is not particularly efficient, because the plumbing is ancient with hot water to the kitchen going half way around the house (to keep the full length of pipe active all the time, necessary for cast iron pipe) and the pipes are uninsulated. This will get better when I finish re-piping in copper with a short, insulated run to the kitchen. And, of course, I use the stove a lot. Combined electric / gas bill about US $250/month. A little higher in the winter, a little lower in the summer.
Post #359,021 by Another Scott 6/16/12 8:10:05 PM Reply	200 W?!?! Zooks man! That's a lot of power for a light fixture, especially in a home. Incandescents are terribly inefficient light sources. Most of the power is given up as heat. If you really want ~ 2500 lumens, you should think about something like this - http://www.amazon.co...ers/dp/B00774Q6E6 2500 lumens at 28 W. The power savings would be significant. Single LEDs are up over 254 lumens/watt now (at low power), and being improved all the time. Most halogens are less than 20 lumens/watt. I keep waiting for reasonably-priced LED lamps that have the qualities of halogens, but they're not quite there yet. We're using compact fluroescents and living with the lack of dimability, etc., for now. One gets used to them (and we haven't had any overheating/fire issues like malraux mentioned, but YMMV). Cheers, Scott.
Post #359,023 by Andrew Grygus 6/16/12 10:11:04 PM Reply	Hmmmm . . . $80? There are already some law suits out there based on rapid decline of light output from LEDs. No, I'm going to wait a while before investing in those to see how it shakes out. They all require replacing fixtures too. I have used curly fluorescents in some locations for at least 15 years, but they are locations where light quality and dimability are not important to me (5 locations). But yes, 200 watts per fixture. Kitchen, office, bathroom, bedroom and dining room. One ceiling fixture in each room (hanging lamps in the dining room). I consider that the bare minimum illumination to work in those rooms (and the ceilings and walls are all painted bright white to maximize light).
Post #359,024 by malraux 6/16/12 10:16:59 PM Reply	Our kitchen: 10 50W halogen can lights, plus a 120W overhead, plus under-cabinet fluorescents (4 or 5 at 8W ea? can't remember). 2 of the 50Ws are over the desk, 2 over the oven space, and the rest over the counters. 200 watts would definitely be bare minimum in a kitchen. Regards, -scott Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.
Post #359,025 by Andrew Grygus 6/16/12 11:12:39 PM Reply	Well, I also have . . . . . another ceiling fixture with a curly fluorescent in it, but it's rarely turned on because that side of the kitchen is storage. Since walls, ceilings and cabinets are bright white it gets enough light. I turn it on only when I need to read small print at the phone.
Post #359,029 by crazy 6/17/12 12:07:55 AM Reply	I suspect you'd REALLY like a couple of these bulbs Ceramic Metal Halide Best full spectrum bulb available and MORE efficient than CFL. http://www.google.co...amic+metal+halide But you are to (hmm) frugal to get one. Go sit under one and read a book for a few minutes or work on some tight electronics and you will see the benefit. You too Box. I'm thinking of putting one over the fish pond for my evening entertainment.
Post #359,030 by Andrew Grygus 6/17/12 12:25:47 AM Reply	How well do they meet the dimmable part of the spec? Warm-up time? If I want bright, I've got an 85-Watt curly fluorescent photo lamp (equiv 300-Watt incandescent). Not dimmable, but pretty much instant on at least.
Post #359,033 by crazy 6/17/12 8:31:24 AM Reply	None No dimming. And warmup is about 5 minutes. And yes, they need a special ballast. They are not a general replacement as people are trying to get you to do. I'm simply pointing out there are non-standard light sources that most people don't deal with, yet the spectrucm they provide is far better than what most people live under. In this house, the guy went all out on a variety of lights, so I got choices.
Post #359,027 by boxley 6/16/12 11:21:02 PM Reply	well you could invest in candles and peanut oil lanterns and get used to that as well. Im investing in incandescent bulbs so I have a 10 year supply. Florescents and leds have their place but a reading light or a workbench I prefer to see without strain or burn Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free American and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 55 years. meep
Post #359,037 by SpiceWare 6/17/12 11:48:24 AM Reply	$1K? Do they have a pool or something? I work from home and have a number of computers that heat up my office so the AC runs quite a bit during the summer. My highest electric last year was $250 for July. Lowest was $75 in November. Highest gas was $35 for January, lowest was $19 for August. Just installed a new AC unit, the radiator fins on the original unit from 99 were all corroded - a blast from the hose and they just fell off. The installer said the old unit was a SEER 10, the new one's SEER 15 so I'm expecting the electric bill to be lower this summer.
Post #359,038 by Another Scott 6/17/12 12:13:44 PM Reply	I think they're just old-school people. IIRC, they live outside Dallas, have a McMansion, probably have the lights on in every room all the time, and like the house to be at 70 F. I think he's a manager with some big defense contractor. They don't like the high bill, but think it's normal and don't think there's much they can do about it. :-/ That's mainly speculation though, based on my likely faulty recollection. But I think the $1k/month is right. Cheers, Scott.

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