not really a good argument there

Post #339,425 by SpiceWare 2/5/11 5:56:19 PM Reply	not really a good argument there this "unity" caused 55 million people across Ontario and 8 states to lose power for a longer period of time than those of us affected by the controlled, rolling, blackouts were. http://en.wikipedia...._Blackout_of_2003
Post #339,453 by jake123 2/6/11 1:37:01 PM Reply	Yeah, it's really too bad that US private infrastructure wasn't developed and maintained properly to deal with the growing demand for electricity, and caused all the other electrical systems tied to it to trip out. In short, the real problem wasn't interconnectedness; it was that one of the parties to it weren't fulfilling their responsibilities to maintain their infrastructure, in order to increase profits.
Post #339,458 by SpiceWare 2/6/11 3:30:40 PM Reply	I see a number of mentions of Canada, Ontario, Québec, etc. here that aren't tied to US power outages. http://en.wikipedia...._of_power_outages
Post #339,581 by jake123 2/9/11 12:02:29 PM Reply	No... the point there was that the cascading failures that led to the great blackout were because of poorly maintained infrastructure in (IIRC) Ohio, which led to a massive failure (high tension long distance infrastructure wires literally melting) causing a massive failure of the ability to maintain the system's balance, leading to the progressive scramming of reactors across those areas. Not weather related. Strictly shitty maintenance on the part of the utility that was supposed to be taking care of it.
Post #339,587 by SpiceWare 2/9/11 3:51:14 PM Reply	thing is 1 private company screwed up, and you're apparently putting blame on all of the "US private infrastructure". While it wasn't weather related, it could easily have been. A single point of failure should not be able to wipe out power for that many people over that widespread of an area. That fact that it could makes linc's whole "unity is better" argument fall flat on its face.
Post #339,590 by hnick 2/9/11 3:59:55 PM Reply	More than one The power companies here laid off a majority of their maintenance staff and came up with a mutual help plan to borrow each others assets if needed. They ignored normal maintenance until failure. When it dropped in the pot, there was a lot more than they could deal with. It was more than one private company. And those companies ARE the regional infrastructure. They just slacked off to make more money.
Post #339,593 by SpiceWare 2/9/11 4:28:14 PM Reply	The findings in wiki put it on FirstEnergy due to lack of tree triming in Ohio, combined with some software bugs that suppressed information for over an hour that would have let them know about the problem. It doesn't mention if others slacked on their maintenance. Well well - this bit seems interesting: The extra publicity given to Ontario's need to import electricity from the United States, mostly due to a decision of the government not to expand the province's power generating capabilities, may also have adversely affected the Conservative government. So by having "unity", you can blame your own shortcomings on others...
Post #339,594 by hnick 2/9/11 4:51:21 PM Reply	Re: The findings in wiki The tree trimming was part of it. They also lost a couple of sections of high tension lines which really screwed things up. I don't think that had anything to do with trees. Two of our friends and one of my wife's extended family were among the people laid off. They were pretty bitter an vocal about the under the table deals that were made to enable their removal. The companies didn't really care about maintenance and they underestimated how much could go wrong in that short a time. They still got their bonuses and rate hikes, so it's all good.

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