IWETHEY v. 0.3.0 | TODO
1,095 registered users | 1 active user | 0 LpH | Statistics
Login | Create New User
IWETHEY Banner

Welcome to IWETHEY!

New Military feeling overextended
[link|http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/nm/20020320/ts_nm/attack_congress_defense_dc_3&printer=1|Not big enough]

Excerpt:

The U.S. military would be without adequate forces in the Pacific and European regions if resources continue to be diverted to Afghanistan (news - web sites) and the United States strikes Iraq, commanders of those regions said on Wednesday.


Gen. Joseph Ralston, chief of the command for the European region, and Admiral Dennis Blair, chief of the Pacific command, told the House Armed Services Committee their forces already were strapped.

"We do not have adequate forces to carry out our missions in the Pacific if the operations in Central Command continue at their ... current pace," Blair said of the effort in Afghanistan to root out the al Qaeda network of Osama bin Laden (news - web sites), which Washington blames for the Sept. 11 attacks on the United States.

With the Bush administration weighing military action against Iraq, which President Bush (news - web sites) included in his "axis of evil," the commanders said that would put additional strain on their regions.

"We do not have forces to do the missions you have outlined," Ralston told Rep. Ike Skelton of Missouri, top Democrat on the panel who posed the question.

I say:

Well, we got off to a good start with the military Clinton left behind. But the Cold War being over is itself over. Time to beef it up, and fast.

And buy the right stuff. Stuff that helps. Fuel-air bombs, daisy cutters, Predators and Tomohawks. The missile defense thing can be cut back if need be.
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfir...e/index.html]
Truth is that which is the case. Accept no substitutes.
If competence is considered "hubris" then may I and my country always be as "arrogant" as we can possibly manage.
New Who are we fighting?
But the Cold War being over is itself over. Time to beef it up, and fast.
To fight who? Where? How are they armed? What's their land strength? Air strength? Naval strength?

Or do we just keep building up until we can fight the rest of the world?
New I've got a problem with the Europe statement
What "missions" do we have in Europe? With Russian invasion fears being, at least barring a coup, a thing of the past, the Balkans? That's Europe's problem and should have been from the start. You want peacekeeping? Fine, EU, keep the peace. But *we* don't need to be there at this particular point in time.

The Pacific and Asia, I think, are legitimate arguments, with China and Korea both doing some sword-rattling.

The commanders themselves may be exhibiting bad hand-wringing cover-their-asses judgement about Iraq. Last time, we had a massive troop buildup, but it turned out the oh-so-powerful Iraqi army was a bunch of over-hyped, under-equipped, downright cowardly incapable pansies. And I seem to remember hearing something about how Afghanistan was going to cost rivers of American blood. Well, gee, we've had a couple of choppers taken down by the enemy, but haven't we had more losses due to friendly fire than to the AlQuada?
"I didn't know you could drive to Europe." -- An eavesdropper, piping in when he overheard a conversation about someone who had driven to Montreal.
New Balkan situation is only stable while pressure is applied.
Thus it has always been. Neither the Serbs not the Bosnian Muslims know how to play well with others. Shove democracy down their throats and wait a generation or two. Nothing short of that will cure them. We've already started to see some real attempts at democracy thereabouts, but it will take a while to take hold. In the meantime, apply pressure to the wound.

Arguably, European nations should be applying the pressure and footing the bill. The mess is in their back yard, after all. But they're too busy whining about those ugly Americans to actually do much of anything.
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfir...e/index.html]
Truth is that which is the case. Accept no substitutes.
If competence is considered "hubris" then may I and my country always be as "arrogant" as we can possibly manage.
New You complain, but offer no rational.
>WHY< is it >OUR< job to handle >EUROPE'S< problem?

Just because they whine about ugly Americans?

So, we have to risk our lives cleaning up someone else's mess if someone else is willing to whine about us?

Dude, that's pathetic even by your standards.
New Re: Balkan situation is only stable while pressure is applie
But they're too busy whining about those ugly Americans to actually do much of anything.

Another reason to feed them their own home-built shit.

We've saved Europe twice (you can argue about how much our involvement in WW1, but no question that we did contribute there - but there's no question *we* won WW2), yet they seem to be ever increasingly anti-American. France, in particular, has anti-Americanism up their collective butts. Next time Germany or anyone else invades you, suck it up, you deserve it.

Me, I'd apply the same to the House of Saudi and our other so-called allies in the mideast. Kuwait? You don't like us? OK. (withdraw all troops). Saudi Arabia? People celebrating in the streets at the bombing of the World Trade Center? OK, withdraw all troops, or, as Jerry Pournelle suggests, raze the ground upon which any such celebration occurred, salt it, and make a monument visible from orbit.

Sadaam Hussein, we don't like you, but this time, we don't mind too terribly much if you move in on the area.

I'm getting a bit tired of political expediency. If your citizens hate us, with state-supported publications egging them on, then you don't deserve our support. The hell with you, Egypt, Saudi, Kuwait.

We have *one* true ally in the Mideast. Israel, like it or not.
"I didn't know you could drive to Europe." -- An eavesdropper, piping in when he overheard a conversation about someone who had driven to Montreal.
New Interesting...

We have *one* true ally in the Mideast. Israel, like it or not.


Hmm...hasn't Israel spied on us and (to be frank) stolen Nuke technology from us?

(They ain't that great an ally.)

(And there is a strong history of Saudia Arabian support for the US.)
New Re: Interesting...
Most (all?) of the people who bombed the World Trade Center were Saudis. The House of Saudi has financed the AlQuada heavily. These are our friends?

Israel has spied on us, true. (Smack'em for that.) But they haven't poured money on terrorist organizations.
"I didn't know you could drive to Europe." -- An eavesdropper, piping in when he overheard a conversation about someone who had driven to Montreal.
New And don'r forget the USS Liberty in 1967!
In 1967 Israel deliberately (i.e. no mistake) attacked the [link|http://home.cfl.rr.com/gidusko/liberty/|USS Liberty] a US Navy intelligence ship.
Alex

"Never express yourself more clearly than you think." -- Neils Bohr (1885-1962)
New Beggars can't be choosers
There aren't a lot of democracies to choose from in the Middle East. In fact, unless you count the region of Anatolia as part of the Middle East, there probably aren't any besides Israel.

We must make do with what we have.
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfir...e/index.html]
Truth is that which is the case. Accept no substitutes.
If competence is considered "hubris" then may I and my country always be as "arrogant" as we can possibly manage.
New Is that why we hosted the Taliban, in Texas, in 1997....
but they are a terribly fundamentalist repressive threat to our security in 2001?

BTW, did you see how they treat their women?

So we'll find an ally in a group that has executed 3000 prisoners in the past.

We must make do with what we have.
Fascinating. Truly fascinating.

I mean, it would be hard to imagine us doing anything worse than what we've done.


To quote your sig back at you.
If competence is considered "hubris" then may I and my country always be as "arrogant" as we can possibly manage.
I see "hubris" and "arrogant" but I don't see "competence" in this little history. Maybe you might try replacing "competence" with "ignorance" in your sig.
New Was there ever a time when such has not been said
by any mil. org. in existence? When Hitler began WW-II, his top admirals(s) beseeched him for "3-4 more years preparation". (Anticipating dealing with Britain that is - not the initial foray of Poland)

Still, the U-boats pillaged for nearly a year against US/Brit shipping without serious losses, before sheer $ and technology (and breaking the code - perhaps #1 as is claimed) - started the reversal towards total rout. (BTW - only in last couple years did the US finally acknowledge the utterly raw deal given Merchant seamen.. the ones dying from those U-boats. At the time they got zippo and until very recently - for the few suptuagenarians left, that is.)

What does it mean when a lone Superpower deems itself naked unless.. it can wage a Theatre war on two fronts simultaneously? (That was *last* year's plea for expanding the mil. budget: a mantra as regular as death, taxes and Tee Vee evangelists. Now we have Dubya and the SS fund to raid AND.. rebates for the top-end. Maybe we now need three fronts capability?)

To me it means: we are planning for several. ""Defensive"" of course.



Ashton
New This is probably bureaucratic empire-building
The US military has maybe one tenth of our special forces and 1 /percent/ of our total manpower in Afghanistan. It's rather unlikely that this small a commitment has strained the US military as badly as the generals claim; most likely they are trying to outmaneuver their fellow generals for a bigger slice of the pie.

That said, I'm kind of surprised by how cheap the campaign is turning out to be -- if we were spending at the rate that we were in 1982 (at the height of the Reagan buildup) the US defense budget would be right around 600 billion dollars. I hope it stays low, too, because beefing it up that much would knock something like 0.3% off the annual real GDP growth, which is serious bad news.
New But this is bigger than just Afghanistan.
We won the first round. But the fight's not over.
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfir...e/index.html]
Truth is that which is the case. Accept no substitutes.
If competence is considered "hubris" then may I and my country always be as "arrogant" as we can possibly manage.
New Gimme a "V"!
Gimme an "I"
Gimme an "E"
Gimme an "T"
Gimme an "N"
Gimme an "A"
Gimme an "M"

The "war" that started with "Get Osama!"

But Osama git hisself away and be hiddin.

So, we "Get the Taliban!"

And the Taliban they be out of central control.

But now we have guerilla units what be hiddin in dem mountains.

So, we "Get the guerillas!"

And we do the ole US-back-local-government-of-democracy (but-really-is-just-another-band-of-thugs) thingie.

We trade gooks for sand-niggers and jungle for mountains and you know what?

I is gonna go home now and fire up mah DVD of Apocalypse Now.

All that is old is new again.
New No..._____there IS something new
*A new generation* raised from momma's* knee on the slogans (unchanged) of past iterations. Wrapped in The Flag, stocked with the Jingoism... and blinkers donned - to blindly go where others have gone.

* fewer and fewer poppas stick around, after the 3-minute Fun part.. nowadays.

The dehumanization is always Step #1: what new epithet shall replace the gooks of the Vietnam prototype? (We weren't screwing around in the Balkans long enought to create a 'Bucktoothed Jap' surrogate there.)

Common denominator though: there's Always marlowesque rhetoric in the sports bars, at this stage of the A) impatience for Action B) further simplification of the Whys for the Action and - just How Far We Should Go *THIS* Time... but without C) Hurting the GNP / shopping toooo much.

[but it'll be Fine to raid the school, medical, SS funds {illusionary as they are anyway} since WTF: mostly it'll hit the smarmy Me-Me-Me Boomers first..] and who wants to train any really Smart kids? Hell, That isn't what our educational system is supposed to produce!

Smart Kids could pronounce cannon fodder and realize They Are it.

(Wish I could find the libretto for The Green Table, a kinda stage ballet of >20 years ago: showing the Pols gesticulating around a Big Green Table / and then as the lights dimmed: showed the *consequences*, the heaped dead burned young bodies. Then later - at the Table - they all shook hands over the 30-yr.old. Cognac. THAT's our Real History)






Damn.. don't we ever tire of re-runs?
New Omniscient LRPD notes: ____ It's Howdy Doody Time!
New Heh heh heh.
Damn.. don't we ever tire of re-runs?
What was that about "those who will not learn from history are doomed to repeat it?

All that is old is new again.

I say we get over there and teach them gooks a lesson about how we'll make them free!
New Who said? - George Santayana said.
George Santayana famously warned that "Those who fail to learn the lessons of history are doomed to repeat it."
Alex

"Never express yourself more clearly than you think." -- Neils Bohr (1885-1962)
New Re: But this is bigger than just Afghanistan.
Sure, but a basic premise of US military planning since the end of the Cold War has been to retain the ability to fight two medium-sized (ie, Gulf War-sized) wars simultaneously on different continents. The Afghan campaign is a lot smaller than the Gulf War, so that's why I think believe the military's testimony to Congress overstated their need.

The "Clinton drawdown" is generally overstated in the press -- in constant dollars we spent about the same as we did from the mid-to-late 80s through the end of the Clinton administration. I think the current Bush proposal is about right, actually. Adding some 50 billion dollars to the budget gives the military room to conduct military operations without having to gut R&D or infrastructure work.

Throwing money at the Pentagon is not guaranteed to produce better results, anymore than throwing money at the local school board will produce more educated students. Better organization and tighter oversight are needed to make sure the money flows where it's needed. Fortunately, Donald Rumsfeld both understands this and has a rep as a truly vicious bureacratic infighter, so I'm modestly hopeful that we will see value for our tax dollars.
New Stars & Stripes says money isn't the problem
[link|http://www.estripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=7421|Bad management is]

Excerpt:

"Today, DOD faces financial management problems that are
pervasive, complex, long standing, and deeply rooted in virtually
all business operations throughout the department," said Gregory
Kutz, director of the GAO?s financial management and assurance
section.

With $100 million set aside in the fiscal 2002 budget for
revamping the system, the Pentagon has started at the most
basic of levels, creating a "blueprint" to correct the problem,
Tina Jonas, deputy undersecretary for Defense and Financial
Management, told the Government Efficiency, Financial
Management and Intergovernmental Relations subcommittee of
House Committee on Government Reform.

The administration is asking Congress to approve a $379 billion
budget request for fiscal 2003, $48 billion more than last year.

The financial departments are paying bills closer to their due
date to reduce interest payments, collecting from contractors
that owe, cracking down on credit card delinquencies by
garnisheeing paychecks, and reducing overpayments or duplicate
payments, Jonas said.

These are solutions Schakowsky said she's heard before. She
pointing out the Pentagon's unproductive past, problems that
still exist today:

Seven years ago, the GAO reported the Pentagon was
unable to reliably report on the costs of its operations.
Seven years ago, the GAO reported the DOD was not
properly reporting billions of dollars of future liabilities
associated with environmental cleanup.
Seven years ago, the GAO reported the Pentagon was
unable to protect assets from fraud, waste, and abuse.
Twelve years ago, the GAO reported the Pentagon's
inventory management was a high risk for failure.
Twelve years ago, the GAO reported the weapon system
acquisition was a high risk for failure.

"Unfortunately, the list goes on and on," Schakowsky said. "We
have heard lots of talk, but we have not seen any progress."

I say:

And let's have accountability, too. Of course.
[link|http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/marlowe/index.html|http://www.angelfir...e/index.html]
Truth is that which is the case. Accept no substitutes.
If competence is considered "hubris" then may I and my country always be as "arrogant" as we can possibly manage.
New Re: Stars & Stripes says money isn't the problem
One I always found funny is from Gore's book Common Sense Government

The DOD spends more on administration of the travel program (2.2 billion) then it spends on travel reimbursments (2 billion). It doesn't list a specific year for that, but the book is from 1995.

Jay
     Military feeling overextended - (marlowe) - (21)
         Who are we fighting? - (Brandioch)
         I've got a problem with the Europe statement - (wharris2) - (8)
             Balkan situation is only stable while pressure is applied. - (marlowe) - (7)
                 You complain, but offer no rational. - (Brandioch)
                 Re: Balkan situation is only stable while pressure is applie - (wharris2) - (5)
                     Interesting... - (Simon_Jester) - (4)
                         Re: Interesting... - (wharris2)
                         And don'r forget the USS Liberty in 1967! - (a6l6e6x)
                         Beggars can't be choosers - (marlowe) - (1)
                             Is that why we hosted the Taliban, in Texas, in 1997.... - (Brandioch)
         Was there ever a time when such has not been said - (Ashton)
         This is probably bureaucratic empire-building - (neelk) - (7)
             But this is bigger than just Afghanistan. - (marlowe) - (6)
                 Gimme a "V"! - (Brandioch) - (4)
                     No..._____there IS something new - (Ashton) - (3)
                         Omniscient LRPD notes: ____ It's Howdy Doody Time! -NT - (Ashton)
                         Heh heh heh. - (Brandioch) - (1)
                             Who said? - George Santayana said. - (a6l6e6x)
                 Re: But this is bigger than just Afghanistan. - (neelk)
         Stars & Stripes says money isn't the problem - (marlowe) - (1)
             Re: Stars & Stripes says money isn't the problem - (JayMehaffey)

The sleek race lines of an outhouse standing on a garbage scow.
76 ms