<high horse action=climb-up>

Post #293,126 by Another Scott 9/18/07 12:29:00 PM Reply	<high horse action=climb-up> You're lumping too many groups together, and too many individuals in those groups. Who is "you guys"? Bush? The major politcal parties? Every single American? Is it fair to blame Robert Mugabe's actions on [link\|http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/13/AR2007031301730.html\|Morgan Tsvangirai]? I don't think so. Don't lump everyone together. The US is very divided politically. That's why little is changing in Congress - the opposition to Bush doesn't yet have the votes necessary to force a change in policy. But things are designed to move slowly in Congress because a measure of stability in government is generally a good thing. There are counter-examples, of course (see Zimbabwe). All indications are that the Democrats are going to increase their strength in Washington in 2008 and at that point you'll start to see significant changes in US foreign (and domestic) policy. I'm willing to bet there are many more US citizens who are upset with the Bush Administration than there are Canadians (in total). ;-) And while it may be true that that hundreds of thousands (or more) have died as a result of Bush's actions (and Congress's inaction), the US military has also helped save large numbers as well (see, e.g., [link\|http://www.pacom.mil/special/0412asia/index.shtml\|Tsunami assistance] at the US Pacific Command. The USA isn't an evil monolith. </high horse> Cheers, Scott.
Post #293,163 by CRConrad 9/19/07 3:17:07 AM Reply	Sorry, but when discussing the conduct of nation-states... ...it certainly seems to me that one of the most relevant groupings of people would be the group of all citizens of each nation-state. That's just elementary logic. As for not "lump[ing] everyone together", YTF not? Sure, you may not all be Dick Cheney -- but then, the rest of you have still let him carry on unfettered for about four or five (and at the very least least three!) years longer than you should have. You don't wanna take the blame for that, you should have had a revolution (or at the very least least, gotten your shit together in the '04 election!) and got rid of him. (Yes, I mean that at least semi-seriously: By not doing so [either way], you showed that the vaunted "stability in government" of the United States of Consumerism was more important to you than those "hundreds of thousands [or at the very least least tens of thousands] of lives" that he's squandered. Everyone in the world doesn't HAVE to agree you made the right judgment there, do they?) So, sorry, but now that you've got off your high horse, you better stay the fuck down off it. 'Coz you were wrong, and Jake was right. [link\|mailto:MyUserId@MyISP.CountryCode\|Christian R. Conrad] (I live in Finland, and my e-mail in-box is at the Saunalahti company.) Ah, the Germans: Masters of Convoluted Simplification. — [link\|http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=1603\|Jehovah]
Post #293,168 by Lily 9/19/07 7:09:01 AM Reply	Your implications and sweeping generalizations... Are a big pile of steaming BULLSHIT.
Post #293,170 by Ashton 9/19/07 7:59:31 AM Reply	Or more simply, That prescribed military response, "No excuse. Sir!" when the Pvt. has been caught doing something stupid. Yes - we Have "no excuse".. (borrowing from Carousel, though that was in ref to having chosen as a swain - a real looser..) "..and all the rest is talk." (We're always finding excuses.. for the slavery, then for the lynchings - later on for the 'Colored Only' nonpersonhood: all while lecturing the world about 'democracy' and celebrating our Wonderfulness.) Now: we have a few thousand military families and their maimed/dead sacrificial cannon fodder - bearing directly: the. only. actual. burdens yet felt in these parts - all for a tacit National tolerance of a cabal of deranged lying zealots. This, while each day new (and increasingly more complete) visual records of the exact nature of the lies and their pattern come to light. That evidence of corruption has reached at least K-2 height - heading for Everest, I guess. No matter though, because Still: the vast majority Say/Do NOTHING to atone for their all-along complicity-of-dunces. (We may have become too dumb to live sanely, but we always hone to perfection our killing machines - it has become our first priority. Notice the frenzied celebration of the Shockn'Awe phase, seen on the \ufffdFox clips from the war run-up. That priority is way before say, health care - even for just all of "the little Murican cheeldrun". About a fifth of those here - get nada, zippo. Priorities.) Snipe away. You can't possibly be 'hard' enough. This is now into the FIFTH YEAR of this corrupt invasion / perpetual carnage and still.. the sheep graze, their kiddies live for collecting the Logo/clothes at the malls - and the rest are zoned out with essential distractions: anything; any noise, game to prevent Noticing what we have become. \ufffd The most concise-yet history I've seen of the long-term prevarications and methodology of all our little wars - showed on a local PBS station last night: [link\|http://www.normansolomon.com/norman_solomon/2007/05/war_made_easy_p.html\| War Made Easy]. Also [link\|http://www.warmadeeasy.com/\|http://www.warmadeeasy.com/] It compares the Same-old root-propaganda employed from Tonkin Gulf on through today's morass - with familiar clips of the perps weaving their magic BS wands. And the consumers going about their grazing. Just like right now. (I Saw - Johnson's Tonkin speech.. and on back to the McCarthyism which never actually goes away among our chicken-hawks - plus most of the early clips shown. I don't really need someone's "interpretation" of the milieu.) This flic could never be seen on a commercial channel here. Bad for bizne$$.
Post #293,171 by Another Scott 9/19/07 8:08:43 AM Reply	Funny, I never would have taken you for a "loyal Bushie". [link\|http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/09/20010920-8.html\|"Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists."] Lumping all Americans together is a page from the same playbook. Oh well. Cheers, Scott.
Post #293,175 by admin 9/19/07 8:42:38 AM Reply	Er, wrong. Rail at the half that actually did vote for him, not the half that didn't. Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #293,181 by imqwerky 9/19/07 9:28:01 AM Reply	Who pissed in your cornflakes? (new thread) Created as new thread #293180 titled [link\|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=293180\|Who pissed in your cornflakes?] Smile, Amy

Welcome to IWETHEY!