whaddya mean? Ady has bin around fer ages

Or at least they should be....

In this case, it depends on how Microsoft does it and how easy it is to change. Gryg makes a good point that most machines stay with the default settings. We also know that MS is very jealous of Google's marketshare in search (and advertising) and they're throwing money at the problem to try to cut Google down to size. There are reasons to be very suspicious of Microsoft's plans here. They shouldn't be allowed to unfairly crush Google through bundling the way they killed Netscape.

My gut tells me that this is an important issue for Google (and Yahoo for that matter). In an ideal world, it wouldn't be decided in the courts (because MS would have been broken up long ago). When Vista starts up, it should ask for the user's choice for default search engine when it asks for network settings and the like.

I fear that if it goes to court it'll be 5-10 years before there's any finality and by that time either Google will be dead or Microsoft will be broken up making any court decision moot.

My $0.02.

Cheers,
Scott.

Post #254,090 by boxley 5/1/06 6:58:32 PM Reply	whaddya mean? Ady has bin around fer ages I tend to side with him on this one. Netscape autodefaults to netscape search. thanx, bill Any opinions expressed by me are mine alone, posted from my home computer, on my own time as a free american and do not reflect the opinions of any person or company that I have had professional relations with in the past 50 years. meep
Post #254,092 by Another Scott 5/1/06 7:08:10 PM Reply	Things are different once you've been found to have a Monop. Or at least they should be.... In this case, it depends on how Microsoft does it and how easy it is to change. Gryg makes a good point that most machines stay with the default settings. We also know that MS is very jealous of Google's marketshare in search (and advertising) and they're throwing money at the problem to try to cut Google down to size. There are reasons to be very suspicious of Microsoft's plans here. They shouldn't be allowed to unfairly crush Google through bundling the way they killed Netscape. My gut tells me that this is an important issue for Google (and Yahoo for that matter). In an ideal world, it wouldn't be decided in the courts (because MS would have been broken up long ago). When Vista starts up, it should ask for the user's choice for default search engine when it asks for network settings and the like. I fear that if it goes to court it'll be 5-10 years before there's any finality and by that time either Google will be dead or Microsoft will be broken up making any court decision moot. My $0.02. Cheers, Scott.
Post #254,093 by andread 5/1/06 7:27:09 PM Reply	so if there was no default then.... by the logic above most users couldn't search would that be better I'd guess most of them have no idea what the box is for I see mine punching in google or yahoo all the time A Play I Some Music w/ Papa Andy Saturday 8 PM - 11 PM ET All Night Rewind 11 PM - 5 PM Reggae, African and Caribbean Music [link\|http://wxxe.org\|Tune In]
Post #254,095 by jbrabeck 5/1/06 8:13:05 PM Reply	Not quite cuz everyone knows how to google or yahoo, which they would continue to do. But if they have to change something to do so, they'll just use whatever is the default. A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. (Herm Albright)
Post #254,118 by andread 5/2/06 9:21:56 AM Reply	Some Info 1) if they go to google and are using IE7 a big red arrow from google comes up pointing to the search box and telling them they can change the default to google 2) as I stated before, if they are going to google or yahoo or wherever then they are not using the box for anything (which if the users are as ignorant as most of the posts in this thread imply then that if exactly what the box is "used" for) A Play I Some Music w/ Papa Andy Saturday 8 PM - 11 PM ET All Night Rewind 11 PM - 5 PM Reggae, African and Caribbean Music [link\|http://wxxe.org\|Tune In]
Post #254,119 by pwhysall 5/2/06 9:39:42 AM Reply	Irrelevant. It's all about the law. What users can do doesn't matter. Peter [link\|http://www.no2id.net/\|Don't Let The Terrorists Win] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Home] Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
Post #254,716 by Arkadiy 5/7/06 8:32:44 PM Reply	This deserves to be framed and hung "What users can do doesn't matter." Indeed. ------ 179. I will not outsource core functions. -- [link\|http://omega.med.yale.edu/~pcy5/misc/overlord2.htm\|.]
Post #254,777 by pwhysall 5/8/06 1:43:19 PM Reply	? Users can just install Firefox. Users can just install Linux. Users can just buy a Mac. I'm not sure I get your point. Peter [link\|http://www.no2id.net/\|Don't Let The Terrorists Win] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Home] Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
Post #254,782 by drewk 5/8/06 1:55:48 PM Reply	Wasn't it your point to begin with? === Purveyor of Doc Hope's [link\|http://DocHope.com\|fresh-baked dog biscuits and pet treats]. [link\|http://DocHope.com\|http://DocHope.com]
Post #254,788 by pwhysall 5/8/06 3:37:20 PM Reply	Indeed But I'm not convinced it's the point that Ark took away from the post. Peter [link\|http://www.no2id.net/\|Don't Let The Terrorists Win] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Home] Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
Post #255,347 by Arkadiy 5/13/06 1:04:31 PM Reply	None of my points are very flattering It does not matter that people are lazy and stupid The law will fix it. Or, it doe not matter that users can now do much more than they used to. We must have a law to ensure the ideal state, when those users can do _everything_ in the best possible way. There might be a couple more. ------ 179. I will not outsource core functions. -- [link\|http://omega.med.yale.edu/~pcy5/misc/overlord2.htm\|.]
Post #255,414 by pwhysall 5/14/06 5:11:54 AM Reply	You've missed my point entirely. Peter [link\|http://www.no2id.net/\|Don't Let The Terrorists Win] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Home] Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
Post #254,121 by inthane-chan 5/2/06 9:45:16 AM Reply	Better idea. First time IE starts, a dialog box pops up with major search engines, asking user to select one for the default search. When somebody asks you to trade your freedoms for security, it isn't your* security they're talking about.*
Post #254,127 by admin 5/2/06 10:07:43 AM Reply	Better better idea. Make sure it's a multi-select, and not a drop-down (with MSN pre-selected, natch). Otherwise the user will just hit "OK" and be done with it. They should have to pick from a list before continuing. Regards, -scott anderson "Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
Post #254,111 by pwhysall 5/2/06 2:03:45 AM Reply	Go read up about having a monopoly And what you can and cannot do once you have one. While it's not illegal to have a monopoly in one or more markets, it's highly not legal to use that monopoly to leverage your entry or marketshare in another. In this case, MSIE having a default search option of MSN is leverage the OS/Browser monopoly in order to increase marketshare in the search market. Google and Firefox are not at all in the same position (Firefox doesn't own Google, and doesn't have any kind of monopoly). Just saying "it's configurable" is no defence. Peter [link\|http://www.no2id.net/\|Don't Let The Terrorists Win] [link\|http://www.kuro5hin.org\|There is no K5 Cabal] [link\|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org\|Home] Use P2P for legitimate purposes!
Post #254,158 by jb4 5/2/06 1:53:22 PM Reply	Come on, Andy, not even you are that dense Matriculated at the BeeP School of Applied Rhetoric, did you? I see you mastered in Reductio ad Absurdum. Congratulations.... jb4 "So don't pay attention to the approval ratings that say 68% of Americans disapprove of the job this man is doing. I ask you this, does that not also logically mean that 68% approve of the job he's not doing? Think about it. I haven't." — Stephen Colbert, at the White House Correspondent's Dinner 29Apr06

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