IWETHEY v. 0.3.0 | TODO
1,095 registered users | 1 active user | 0 LpH | Statistics
Login | Create New User
IWETHEY Banner

Welcome to IWETHEY!

New Re: In essence you admit ...
The Dome of the Rock, was built in 687 A.C., so Muslim Arabs have been around been around continuously since at least then. Wasteland or not in the past, you do not now have rights to it. I suggest you accept the territory provided by the UN in 1948 and leave it at that.

You want to start making up rules about territorial ownership? Then why not Hamas making up their rules about it. The Armenians should be claiming part of Jerusalem. Right? That path leads to eternal warfare.

You need to convince the Palestinians they were not displaced, not me.

It makes perfect sense to me that Jews in the occupied territories become Palestinian citizens. It that's were you live, be my guest. Reciprocity - just like the Israeli Bedouins.
Alex

Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. -- Blaise Pascal (1623-1662)
New Do you for 1 second believe that Jews could live...
in a Palestinian state. Let us look at the Arab world. Saudia Arabia, no-Moslems can't live there at all, Egypt, Jordan, persecute non-Moslems. There is a reason why 800,000 Jews fled Arab countries in the early 1950's. Look at what the Palestinians are doing to Christian Arabs in Bethlehem? Do you really think that Jews could live there? Would you go to live under a brutal dictatorship? What about the Jews who lived for generations in Syria, Iraq, Egypt, etc. and became refugees after 1948, maybe they should also have the right of return?
New It's possible for Jews to live under mostly Arab rule.
You yourself said they did it for generations. There are 2 Jews that have been (and are) living in Kabul (under Taliban rule, no less). These two don't happen to get along, but that is another story.

So are you saying the creation of Israel "poised the well"? Sure, undo the whole thing and have the Jews return to Syria, Iran, wherever. Diversity is a good thing. Just like peace.
Alex

Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. -- Blaise Pascal (1623-1662)
New You really show your ignorance
The UN partition plan in 1947 was not accepted and did not go into effect, in fact, Israel ended up with more territory then the partition plan allocated. If we go with the UN plan, then Jerusalem would be an international city, not the capital of a Palestinian state. Is that what you propose? The irony is that "Palestine" before the 1950's was associated with Jews, in fact, that in the years before Israel\ufffds birth, those who spoke of "Palestinians" were usually referring to the region\ufffds Jewish residents. Arab leaders *rejected* the notion of a unique Palestinian Arab identity, insisting that Palestine was merely a part of "Greater Syria." The Jerusalem Post (an Israeli English newspaper) started out as the Palestine Post.
New Goodness, bluke. First you tell me Palestinians are a myth,
and now you tell me they are (or were) actually Jews. If that is what you are saying, I will grant you that Jews and Palestinian Arabs are same people. They just seem to have some cultural or religious differences. Incidentally, in the mid to late 1950's I was living in New York City in the Lower East Side section of Manhattan. There were a lot of Jews in the neighborhood. One of the local movie theaters (on Clinton! Street) was in fact called Palestine. Today, in common usage, Palestinians are the Arabs of the region. Perhaps this shows the folly of putting to much weight on names.

In 1948, I was 8 years old, a "displaced person" of WW-II, and lived in a UN refuge camp in Germany. My world was small. Pardon me for not knowing the details of the negotiations on the creation of Israel (not that I can trust what you say). Actually, an international Jerusalem makes a lot of sense. It would remove some sharp points of friction. It would have been a Solomonic choice.

You may (or may not) remember the UAR, the United Arab Republic. Egypt and Iraq, IIRC. You like to lump all Arabs together and maybe you have a point. If these idiots could get along, perhaps what is needed is that they join politically including also Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Oman, the other little kingdoms, and of course the Palestinian Arabs of the occupied territories. The US should get into the "democratic nation building" business again and give aid (same as to Israel on a per capita basis). It would clear up those refuge camps. Over time, peace would be assured. Does that sound like a plan to you? You definitely could not complain about where Arafat was born. :)

Israel did have definite borders in 1967 before the Arab attack. Those are the borders that very few would contest. If Israel wanted peace lifting the occupation of the lands beyond these borders would be a major step. Not doing so is the major cause of the troubles you face. There are other causes, to be sure.
Alex

Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction. -- Blaise Pascal (1623-1662)
New Minor nit re that last.
There are such things as natural geographic features. Surrendering a mountain-top to a.. not merely likely? future assailant - but an almost certain one: sounds really stupid to me. The Brits especially liked plane geometry, arbitrary straight lines with no slightest consideration of the possibility? likelihood! of future defensibility from the intractable, always around.

There is no sane way to 'ignore' the capabilites of modern weaponry - nor even the continuing religious fantasies (God Gave this ___ to ___ yada yada) - those of Israeli religious corporations and of Their various ones. Only can these 'scriptures' be entirely ignored OR: each group can follow their fav latest interpretation..

As each is, has been doing - and will continue ad nauseum. Org. religion is the major cause of eternal warfare, intolerance and {ugh} that horrible homo-sap Righteousness ie stubborness beyond all human compromise.

Humans made these lines in the sand. Life has occurred since. Humans will make the next lines - leave this mess to God\ufffd and Be Certain that blood will continue to flow as always.



We could OTOH Grow Up.. aided by the current rubric of, Terrorism == Evil. Any Port in a congenitally brainless-Storm, I say.


Ashton
a Terminal-pox on All the Mindset-Manufacturers as have enslaved 'Mankind' since the caves.
New LRPD: "An 'Outside Context Problem' if ever there was one."!
     The Myth Of The Palestinian People - (bluke) - (28)
         Mythical palestinians. - (static)
         Middle-Eastern Politics, In A Nutshell - (pwhysall)
         Re: The Myth Of The Palestinian People - (a6l6e6x) - (17)
             And therefore what? - (bluke) - (4)
                 Re: And therefore what? - (a6l6e6x) - (3)
                     Who exactly did that land belong to? - (bluke) - (2)
                         Re: Who exactly did that land belong to? - (a6l6e6x)
                         It goes back to pre-history - (nking)
             You still haven't answered my question ... - (bluke) - (11)
                 It's not anything complicated. - (a6l6e6x) - (10)
                     Yeah, but this is Sam Clemens we are talking about - (mhuber) - (1)
                         Yeah, probably like Las Vegas at the same time. - (a6l6e6x)
                     In essence you admit ... - (bluke) - (7)
                         Re: In essence you admit ... - (a6l6e6x) - (6)
                             Do you for 1 second believe that Jews could live... - (bluke) - (1)
                                 It's possible for Jews to live under mostly Arab rule. - (a6l6e6x)
                             You really show your ignorance - (bluke) - (3)
                                 Goodness, bluke. First you tell me Palestinians are a myth, - (a6l6e6x) - (2)
                                     Minor nit re that last. - (Ashton) - (1)
                                         LRPD: "An 'Outside Context Problem' if ever there was one."! -NT - (Ashton)
         Practical solution over ten years. - (Ashton) - (7)
             Sounds like my proposed solution for the Balkans - (Ric Locke)
             Well, Brigham Young called it the Promised Land. - (a6l6e6x) - (1)
                 West Bank == Western Slope? - (Steve Lowe)
             Curious, why not give utah to the palestinians? - (boxley) - (3)
                 Palestinians can fight their Arab brothers for the honor - - (Ashton) - (2)
                     Well since in our own lives we generally do :) -NT - (boxley)
                     Well since in our own lives we generally do :) -NT - (boxley)

The very ink with which history is written is merely fluid prejuidice.
58 ms