Post #112,103
7/30/03 5:46:32 PM
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So long.
I have deleted this post a lot today.
I am leaving IWETHEY. I'm not happy about it, but I can't think of anything else to do. To be quite honest, it's no longer possible for me to post here in a civil manner, and I no longer feel that IWETHEY is a community of my peers.
Every time I browse these forums I'm left with a bad taste in my mouth -- too many legitimately smart people more interested in putting others down instead of saying anything genuinely thought provoking, too many people concentrating on the cutting remark instead instead of a legitimate riposte. Whatever. I'm discovering that there are too many distractions in my life these days, and IWETHEY sets me off too much to be classified as anything but.
I tried to do this once before, but was eventually pulled back. Too much history, I suppose. For some reason I don't feel the pull of history is as inexorable as it was back then. Everything sounds too shrill these days.
It's not big loss to you guys -- I rarely posted here anyway, at least not lately. I suppose I fall into the category of "seagull poster" or whatever. And because I haven't paticipated much I really have no right to expect that the community will ease up on the intellectual snobbery and get back to being thought-provoking, instead of merely abusive. I suspect at least a few of you will say "good riddance. Next!" Such is life... or as the French say, "Freedom Fries."
I wish all of you well, and hope IWETHEY continues to turn into whatever you all want it to. I find it very alienating these days -- the dangers of lurking I suppose -- so off I go to find some other pocket of the web to hole up in. Or maybe I'll just concentrate on finishing my novel.
Have fun, it was great for about 98% of the ride.
Christopher B. Wright (wrightc@ubersoft.net)
"We are all born originals -- why is it so many of us die copies?"
- Edward Young
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Post #112,106
7/30/03 5:54:36 PM
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Wish I could talk you out of it...
One...because I enjoyed having you around..I love your strip...and when you do post, infrequently as it has become, it is usually always worth reading.
However, I have noticed what you are referring to in your post. It is alarming and I think will end up destroying this community at some point. A good flame war now and then...a heated debate that may degenerate into something worse...these are tolerable...now it appears people are just insulting for the sake of being insulting.
So while I tell you that you will be missed, I cannot blame you for your decision nor will I do anything other than to wish you well and tell you that I will continue to be a faithful reader of the strip...which is one of the top level links on my home page.
Cheers friend.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #112,111
7/30/03 6:12:09 PM
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Ditto.
I have to say, I'm not around here as much as I'd like, mainly due to time constraints. I'm still reading a lot though, and it's pretty obvious to me who and what are the "guilty" parties at this time.
Norm is definitely part of the problem - but only in the sense that he isn't really "in charge" in his own head. I deal with that by just not responding to his posts, and ignoring the heck out of him.
rcareaga, you should know better. If you have 1/10th of the brains that you seem to, then you should know that your repeated Norm-bashing attacks aren't doing your credibility one bit of good. Same goes for you, gfolkert. Follow Ashton's example, except for that one slip he did today.
Marlowe is definitely part of a different problem, that I'm not going to touch on here.
And all ye, give up on this holier than thou crap - none of us are holier than the other, except perhaps CRC. ;)
And though you hold the keys to ruin of everything I see/With every prison blown to dust, my enemies walk free/Though all the kingdoms turn to sand and fall into the sea/ I'm mad about you I'm mad about you
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Post #112,113
7/30/03 6:14:39 PM
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So I am the Crux...
Tis fine by me...
--
[link|mailto:greg@gregfolkert.net|greg],
[link|http://www.iwethey.org/ed_curry|REMEMBER ED CURRY!]
Your sunburnt skin is as beautiful as gangrenous flesh peeled from an
amputated limb.
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Post #112,140
7/30/03 9:04:24 PM
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Re: Ditto.
I have weighed inthane-chan's criticisms and--after due consideration--rejected them. I have been fairly easy on Norm lately with the exception of three or four tart responses to some recent "argument from design" posts that were conspicuously witless even by his subterranean standards. I have boggled aloud at some some of Nightowl's inanities this week, but have refrained from actually abusing her since she seems a benign individual even as she is simultaneously, taken as a representative specimen of passive and lavishly ill-informed American citizenry, an appalling example of the woolly foundation upon which Dubya's support rests in large measure. I have no apologies to make on that score either.
I'm prepared to consider others' objections to my posts, and also urge cwbrenn to reconsider.
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #112,144
7/30/03 9:24:25 PM
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Boggling
I have boggled aloud at some some of Nightowl's inanities this week, but have refrained from actually abusing her since she seems a benign individual even as she is simultaneously, taken as a representative specimen of passive and lavishly ill-informed American citizenry, an appalling example of the woolly foundation upon which Dubya's support rests in large measure. How can you refer to her with words such as "inanities", "benign". "passive", "ill-informed", "appalling", "wooly", etc... and honestly say that your statements don't qualify as abusive? Don't know what your definition of abuse is but I do know that the above easily qualifies as being both caustic and abrasive.
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Post #112,146
7/30/03 9:33:33 PM
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Then, demanding euphemism: you shall decry mere accuracy?
Yes, it's nice to be nice. And most often I feel a tendency to overlook the inexplicable, too. As does apparently - the object of your scorn.
Three choices: Ignore. Point out. Attempt to lead in direction of education, perhaps beginning the process - when imagining you might see - Where to Start?
Maybe there is a fourth. Wanna volunteer for #3?
Ashton
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Post #112,157
7/30/03 10:16:19 PM
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It does take patience and endurance
And I'm sure it's frustrating to see the world heading inexorably toward tragic results. Personally, I don't have either the time or patience to engage in a systematic correction of the faulty reasoning of the average Americans view on the world at large - I think it sucks.
But just as important as being right or wrong, there is the fundamental idea of respect for persons other than our own self and likeminded individuals. One must seperate the idea of respecting an individual versus respecting their views, opinions, and actions.
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Post #112,147
7/30/03 9:34:16 PM
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Re: Boggling
My terms are descriptive, not abusive. Have you read her political posts?
Next.
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #112,152
7/30/03 9:52:10 PM
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Maybe, but are they necessary or appropriate?
Maybe it's the summer doldrums or something. Several old souls around here seem to have gotten cranky. :-(
Rand writes: My terms are descriptive, not abusive.
I'm sure you believe that, but you must recognize that many won't take them that way. Would you use them in polite, face-to-face, conversation with strangers?
If a poster here bothers you (or anyone reading) to the extent that you (or anyone reading) feels that you need to criticize them rather than the content of their posts, then perhaps it would be better for everyone concerned if you (or anyone reading) implement the CSS technique discussed [link|http://twiki.iwethey.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IwtKillfiles|here] on the Twiki.
We're a small group - only 110 IDs have been active in the last 3 months (see the "active users" link at the top of the page). Far fewer than that post here even irregularly. It's not going to do anyone here any good to have iWeThey shrink further. Let's not try to change others to match our image, and try not to take offense.
</soapbox>
My $0.02.
Cheers,
Scott.
(Who really likes slugbug's [link|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/content/show?contentid=112141|idea].)
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Post #112,160
7/30/03 10:23:45 PM
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Re: Maybe, but are they necessary or appropriate?
Another_Scott wonders Would you use [the terms objected to] in polite, face-to-face, conversation with strangers? If I deemed them appropriate, yes. Some of the terms cited above as objectionable have been "inanities" "benign" [term of abuse? news to me] "passive" "ill-informed" "appalling" "woolly", and several of these have been assigned to abstract classes and not to zIWT individuals. However, I appear to have generated more ill-feeling here than I realized. I would certainly consider retiring if a plurality of active participants regard my contributions as poisoning the well. I'm not going to amend the tone. I don't get the impression, though, that most of the regulars object. I rather think I'll have a lengthy response to poor Nightowl, who seems determined to make herself a poster child of all that is jaw-droppingly wrong with the Bush lumpenproletariat, later this evening. I'll wear my kid gloves. cordially, Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #112,167
7/30/03 10:35:19 PM
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Re: Maybe, but are they necessary or appropriate?
I rather think I'll have a lengthy response to poor Nightowl, who seems determined to make herself a poster child of all that is jaw-droppingly wrong with the Bush lumpenproletariat, later this evening. I'll wear my kid gloves. Huh? I have no idea what that means. I can not stand Bush. Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,168
7/30/03 10:39:01 PM
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Just a suggestion
Opinions on such matters are best expressed in the Political forum.
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Post #112,179
7/30/03 11:42:05 PM
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Re: Just a suggestion
Sorry, Chris.
I attempted to escape the political forum earlier, and am still attempting to do so.
I do not wish to engage in a For Bush Against Bush war, just explain that I am certainly not a poster child for the Bush campaign.
And as for people attempting to put me in with any class of people, or any group of people who think in a given way, it's completely impossible. I fit in no group of people, anywhere, completely as in their way of thinking. I am completely unique, and there isn't anyone else like me, anywhere.
Nightowl >8# :)
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,153
7/30/03 10:01:46 PM
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You are passing judgement.
My terms are descriptive, not abusive. Have you read her political posts? And then claiming that your judgement is a fact (i.e. descriptive). Offhand, I would question whether a fair judgement for a person could be rendered by the character and quality of their posts in an obscure out of the way forum. Now whether it qualifies as abusive is up for grabs - I have not followed the nature of your exchanges. But at least in the last few exchanges, you have been caustic and abrasive. As to whether that lack of patience is justified, I won't say. But if the only transaction that I had monitored had been the last few, I'd say you are being abusive. As for the political forums and politics at large, there is no longer reasoned discussion (opting for name calling and sloganeering). Take Marlowe, for example. I disagree with practically every position he has ever posted. But unlike you guys, I don't disrespect Marlowe as a person. You see, if you keep calling him an idiot or manage to stifle his voice, you've managed nothing other than reducing the IWETHEY population. And that's the heart of the problem. Everyone here seems to think that what the say on IWETHEY actually makes a difference. In a small wee way it probably manages to turn a few heads, but considering the population of the world is going on 5 billion, it's not even a drop in the bucket. In my measly opinion, IWETHEY is a technical forum that also allows the luxory to express our own views of the world. It is not, I repeat, not a community dedicated to actually solving the world's socio, political, economic problems. Instead of viewing participants as heads to be convinced and assuaged, I'd suggest the more subtle tact of treating everyone in the community as a resource that can be tapped at will.
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Post #112,175
7/30/03 11:31:06 PM
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a nit picked
considering the population of the world is going on 5 billion Alas, it passed six billion late in the last century. I think it was under three billion when I was dropped in 1952, just contributing to the problem. cordially, Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #112,162
7/30/03 10:26:13 PM
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Opinions
"Never judge a person by their opinions. Some of the nicest people I know have the most awful opinions" - I think it was a famous newspaper guy that said that. Generally true, I've found.
There's seldom reason to be harsh with anyone here. Those displaying ignorance can be educated, and if they don't accept education, they can be ignored.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #112,214
7/31/03 9:20:02 AM
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Points for pith
Those displaying ignorance can be educated, and if they don't accept education, they can be ignored. Yup. This place hasn't stressed me out since ... (Let's see, what does the SIG say?) ... about 2001. ===
Implicitly condoning stupidity since 2001.
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Post #112,163
7/30/03 10:28:23 PM
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Re: Boggling
I have boggled aloud at some some of Nightowl's inanities this week, but have refrained from actually abusing her since she seems a benign individual even as she is simultaneously, taken as a representative specimen of passive and lavishly ill-informed American citizenry, an appalling example of the woolly foundation upon which Dubya's support rests in large measure. How can you refer to her with words such as "inanities", "benign". "passive", "ill-informed", "appalling", "wooly", etc... and honestly say that your statements don't qualify as abusive?
Don't know what your definition of abuse is but I do know that the above easily qualifies as being both caustic and abrasive. BRAVO!!!!!! And thank you, as well. I completely and wholly agree. And I don't know whatever gave anyone the idea that I support Dubya... I do nothing of the kind. Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,172
7/30/03 11:06:16 PM
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Re: Boggling
My dear Nightowl...I'm pleased beyond measure to learn that you deplore Bush. But I'm not made significantly happier to learn that a vote against the pResident comes from a vast stratum of politically ignorant--and I'm heartily sorry if that strikes you or others as a disparaging label, but "ignorant" is as nearly neutral a term as I can devise for what you have written at such length in recent days--occasional voters.
This country, and the world in consequence, is in huge trouble. Part of the reason that the country is in huge trouble is that a significant fraction of the active electorate looks out upon the world with a viewpoint no more sophisticated than that which you have set forth in your recent posts. That you hold such a viewpoint does not make you a bad individual any more than your moral and historical forbear in late 1930s Germany should be faulted: If those Jews/Gypsies/homosexuals were taken away, the Authorities must have had a good reason, and anyway we're annexing the Sudetenland and invading Poland, so what could possibly be wrong?
You represent, unfortunately, a naïve assumption that our oligarchs know what's best for you. Actually, they probably do know what's best for you, and have devoted their careers to making certain you never get it.
cordially,
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
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Post #112,173
7/30/03 11:13:33 PM
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Re: Boggling
My dear Nightowl...I'm pleased beyond measure to learn that you deplore Bush. But I'm not made significantly happier to learn that a vote against the pResident comes from a vast stratum of politically ignorant--and I'm heartily sorry if that strikes you or others as a disparaging label, but "ignorant" is as nearly neutral a term as I can devise for what you have written at such length in recent days--occasional voters. Well, I did vote against him, and it did no good. In fact, I still have doubts about the outcome of that election. But kicking and screaming won't change it. I admit I am ignorant of political matters. I have admitted that repeatedly, and that it is by choice. The few times I learned anything about politics and participated gained me absolutely nothing, so I pretty much stopped participating except in situations where I truly knew what I believed and who was standing for it. But admitting I am ignorant does not mean I agree with all your other descriptive words, I do not. This country, and the world in consequence, is in huge trouble. Part of the reason that the country is in huge trouble is that a significant fraction of the active electorate looks out upon the world with a viewpoint no more sophisticated than that which you have set forth in your recent posts. That you hold such a viewpoint does not make you a bad individual any more than your moral and historical forbear in late 1930s Germany should be faulted: If those Jews/Gypsies/homosexuals were taken away, the Authorities must have had a good reason, and anyway we're annexing the Sudetenland and invading Poland, so what could possibly be wrong? I agree that the country has problems, but I am not capable of solving them, nor would my education in politics solve them. I at least am realistic, and it isn't for me to save the world. You represent, unfortunately, a naïve assumption that our oligarchs know what's best for you. Actually, they probably do know what's best for you, and have devoted their careers to making certain you never get it. I do not naively believe that the oligarchs, (had to look that one up too), know what's best for me. I simply believe at this time I have no power to change them. I wait for the next election, hope there will be a moral and honest candidate, and vote again when it's my turn. Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,182
7/31/03 12:41:29 AM
7/31/03 1:27:45 AM
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Aww, geez
Were I to call X (a hypothetical contributor here) a "fool," this would be intended purely as a descriptive term. Should X's contributions strike a majority of the active posters as keen and cogent, then my powers of description would be rightly discounted. If X's contributions be judged horseshit, however, I would wonder at being criticized for calling X a fool rather than "misinformed" or "ill-advised." Don't most of you heartily disparage these weasel-words when they're employed in the service of "political correctness"?
cordially,
[edit: typo]
Die Welt ist alles, was der Fall ist.
Edited by rcareaga
July 31, 2003, 01:27:45 AM EDT
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Post #112,185
7/31/03 1:10:16 AM
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Take it elsewhere
In my estimation, your prose qualify as self-righteous indignation. Yes, I can understand your sense of urgency, but no I don't understand your campaign of condescension.
Anyhow, the Godwyn Line was crossed, so this thread has no signal left to carry. Take any semblance of what's left of a discussion back over to politics.
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Post #112,194
7/31/03 5:55:28 AM
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Y'know - I know of only one person here who admits to
taking orders, speaks of regularly "asking permission to ___"
Amazing how a forum manager appears unbidden, ready to perform triage towards requisite forum locations, correct comments (like the above 'descriptive' ones) which may be accurate, but [implicitly] ought never to be said.
In your opinion. Others may disagree about the hows and whens and ifs. And, I do. As to locale - personally, I can't conceive of a 'social' topic which does not in some way reference or contain 'politics' - which is, after all: about the social behaviour of putatively self-governing groups here and there. Not everything "about politics generally" necessarily belongs in a Politics forum - which generally deals with argument er "within that arena". It's a meta- kinda thing. Unsubtlety is so jejeune.
Further, and on more than one occasion - Nightowl, a person IIRC >30 years of age - has volunteered her views on (the idea of) 'politics', and limned her level of interest and knowledge on the topic. Having so volunteered, and with requisite "I'm so confused" self-commentary upon this predicament in which she finds herself: she has, IMO delivered an invitation for comments. Else why mention the topics? and so provocatively..
Such replies are apt to vary from the merely astonished onwards towards useful perspectives of the sort, Here are some angles on this subject, why it is likely important -even to you- and lastly: might even contain some suggestions for beginning to explore this heady Idea. In fact, both Jake and I (maybe others) offered some remarks of the latter kind, generally refrained from comments upon how it could be that a person might retain such a blank -?- for such an extended period of life.
Lastly, when all the above combines with many other expressed attitudes of general insouciance (a word precisely suited - tough if it isn't seen on cereal boxes) - such expressions veritably beg to be A) ignored (which also Can be rude) or D'Oh: B) commented upon.
Your opinions are noted, your 'orders' are ignored. Those here (or anywhere) who repeatedly indulge in excess become pariahs - and are dealt with in the usual way. (Rarely does a manager manage to alter the process. This despite that admonition from the Highest Office: Watch What You Say!)
Ashton
Paranoia is what happens to the minority when the majority abandons vigilance. via the ex-cwbrenn
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Post #112,223
7/31/03 9:41:42 AM
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Feel free to ignore mein "orders"
I also suggested (though more politely) that the other party involved take their opinion into the forum dedicated to subjects dealing with politics. Since I have no power of enforcement (nor do I desire such), feel free to carry on in whatever manner you deem reasonable. I don't make the mistake that my words are objective (i.e. descriptive) - they are merely opinions - perhaps best prefaced as such in the future.
This subthread represents a decent microcosm of what the original poster had in mind (feel free to tack on the words IMO at any juncture). I have a total disinterest in either's political viewpoint, yet I get sucked into it all the same.
Yes it's my fault for getting short. And yes I too will leave y'all to wallow in your opines in the "Open Forum". The number of forum I visit on IWETHEY is shrinking over time. Something that I don't generally like, but find it the only strategy to maintain normalcy in these climes - preferring not to give up the forums in toto as the original caller. So when y'all have completed your romp through Politics in this forum, give me a notice in one of the other forii.
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Post #112,287
7/31/03 4:27:15 PM
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Re: Feel free to ignore mein "orders"
I also suggested (though more politely) that the other party involved take their opinion into the forum dedicated to subjects dealing with politics. Since I have no power of enforcement (nor do I desire such), feel free to carry on in whatever manner you deem reasonable. I don't make the mistake that my words are objective (i.e. descriptive) - they are merely opinions - perhaps best prefaced as such in the future. I didn't take what you said as bad. I think you were just redirecting me to the proper forum, and I understand that. I wouldn't have expressed the opinion of Bush that I expressed here OR there, however, had I not been given the impression that people here thought my posts were representative of the poster child for his cause... I apologize, but I was only clarfying to the poster in question that that couldn't be farther from the truth. Yes it's my fault for getting short. And yes I too will leave y'all to wallow in your opines in the "Open Forum". The number of forum I visit on IWETHEY is shrinking over time. Something that I don't generally like, but find it the only strategy to maintain normalcy in these climes - preferring not to give up the forums in toto as the original caller. So when y'all have completed your romp through Politics in this forum, give me a notice in one of the other forii. I intend to take my response to Ashton to the Politics forum, and any other "political" responses that I may have to make from here, despite my misgivings about being IN the Politics forum to begin with. I didn't know you were apparently the moderator? or guide of this forum, and I respect your request. Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,288
7/31/03 4:35:00 PM
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He's not.
I didn't know you were apparently the moderator? or guide of this forum, and I respect your request. We all are. This is a "self-moderated" forum...done by all participants. If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #112,290
7/31/03 4:52:21 PM
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Re: He's not.
Hmmmm then why did Ashton refer to him as the "Forum manager?"
Confused owl.
Nightowl >8#
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,291
7/31/03 4:53:32 PM
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Ashton was being wry.
Or sarcastic. Or something similar. Take your pick. :-)
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #112,292
7/31/03 4:55:20 PM
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It should become a conditioned response.
Confused owl to Ashton's posts ;-) If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #112,293
7/31/03 4:56:30 PM
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Re: It should become a conditioned response.
Confused owl
to Ashton's posts ;-) Hehehehe! It already is!!!! No offense to Ashton, but I have to ask John the most questions about his posts than probably any others in here! ;) Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,238
7/31/03 10:38:47 AM
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Re: Y'know - I know of only one person here who admits to
I'll answer this later after I go get the huge dictionary again. :)
Nightowl >8#
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,248
7/31/03 11:49:53 AM
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Ashton's like that.
And that's a good thing. I learn lots just from reading his posts, even when they don't make sense to me...
And though you hold the keys to ruin of everything I see/With every prison blown to dust, my enemies walk free/Though all the kingdoms turn to sand and fall into the sea/ I'm mad about you I'm mad about you
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Post #112,285
7/31/03 4:21:29 PM
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Re: Ashton's like that.
And that's a good thing. I learn lots just from reading his posts, even when they don't make sense to me... Me too, and many others here too. I just wish John's wonderful dictionary didn't weigh almost half as much as I do! LOL! And yes, I know there's an online one, but I'm just so much happier with a real book. :) Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,275
7/31/03 3:42:09 PM
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Heads up
I believe the spelling is "jejune".
-Mike
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.
Andre Gide (1869 - 1951)
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Post #112,344
7/31/03 9:07:09 PM
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Re: Heh.. 90% of the time when I 'type'___'system'
I gets 'sysytem'.. too.
Improperly burned firmware. Warranty expired.
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Post #112,411
8/1/03 11:56:06 AM
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Batting 1000 (7 for 7) with "jejeune" tho :-)
And you seem to do consistently well with "system" here.
Maybe you are concentrating harder on the tricky words?
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.
Andre Gide (1869 - 1951)
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Post #112,422
8/1/03 2:52:49 PM
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You have too much time on your hands ;-) c-a-t-a ^h^h
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Post #112,289
7/31/03 4:49:32 PM
7/31/03 9:05:53 PM
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Re: Y'know - I know of only one person here who admits to
I moved this post manually over to Politics because I had tried to jump it there.
I believe I successfully did that with the third reply to this post (new thread)
Nightowl >8#
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
Edited by Nightowl
July 31, 2003, 09:05:53 PM EDT
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Post #112,333
7/31/03 8:18:38 PM
7/31/03 9:09:05 PM
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Re: Y'know - I know of only one person here who admits to
Uh Oh. I wanted this post to jump to politics....
It didn't.
Can anyone (admin) move it there, or do you have any suggestions how I could?
Thanks!
Nightowl >8#
P.S. Never mind, I manually moved it there and linked it to the reply to the first one. :)
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
Edited by Nightowl
July 31, 2003, 09:09:05 PM EDT
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Post #112,339
7/31/03 8:44:16 PM
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Posts can't be moved. Some more tips...
Hi,
By design and by choice, posts can't be moved by [link|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/user?userid=1&backurl=http%3a//z.iwethey.org/forums/render/user/userStatistics%3fbackurl%3dhttp%253a//z.iwethey.org/forums/render/user/activeUsers%253fbackurl%253dhttp%25253a//z.iwethey.org/forums/render/forum/show%25253fforumid%25253d4|admin] or anyone else.
If you want your post to show up in a different forum, make sure you click the "As New Topic" checkbox, and use the dropdown box below it to select the forum you want. Then click the Save button.
As a general principle, it's probably worth your while to experiment with the various posting functions and options in the [link|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/forum/show?forumid=4|Test Forum]. Many of the options are simpler to figure out by experimentation than by having someone try to explain it.
HTH.
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #112,340
7/31/03 8:46:35 PM
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Re: Posts can't be moved. Some more tips...
Thanks, I know what I did wrong. I didn't check the checkbox, just made the selection.
Is it acceptable to copy it and paste it into the Politics forum, and then delete all the content but the direction there in the one in here?
Thanks.
Nightowl >8#
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,341
7/31/03 9:00:01 PM
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There are no moderators here. Use your judgement.
As long as you follow the [link|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/forum/show?forumid=5|Forum Guidelines] and consider the audience here, you can post however you like. If you're doing something that someone finds annoying, they'll probably let you know.
Show initiative! Charge ahead and wait to be corrected later. :-)
Yes, you can delete a post and manually move it elsewhere if you'd like (though copying it might make more sense if the post already has a reply). If someone wants to see what happened, they can examine the Edit History. If I understand what you want to do, you'll need to manually add a link to the redirected post (if you want to make it easy for your readers to find it). How to do that is left as an exercise for the poster.
If you have more questions like this, they should probably be moved to [link|http://z.iwethey.org/forums/render/forum/show?forumid=6|Tips For New zIWETHEY Users].
HTH.
Cheers,
Scott.
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Post #112,345
7/31/03 9:08:04 PM
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Re: Posts can't be moved. Some more tips...
Thanks Scott, it didn't have any replies, so I moved it. :)
I only asked the question in here because it was ChrisR who wanted the topic moved, and his post about it was in here. :) Sorry, I'll ask questions like tha in the tips forum from here on. :)
Thanks again!
Nightowl >8#
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,343
7/31/03 9:04:15 PM
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Re: Y'know - I know of only one person here who admits to (new thread)
Created as new thread #112342 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=112342|Re: Y'know - I know of only one person here who admits to]
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,207
7/31/03 8:33:26 AM
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Not an easy lesson to learn
Which is obvious from what followed here.
I've had my own issues over time in exactly this regard.
Which is why I said >I wish<...knowing full well that the issue identified would >not< change...since being >correct< is more important than being nice.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #112,211
7/31/03 8:56:44 AM
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Took me a long time
but I try not to post in threads that feel more hostile than informative - no matter the content.
Imric's Tips for Living
- Paranoia Is a Survival Trait
- Pessimists are never disappointed - but sometimes, if they are very lucky, they can be pleasantly surprised...
- Even though everyone is out to get you, it doesn't matter unless you let them win.
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Nothing is as simple as it seems in the beginning,
As hopeless as it seems in the middle,
Or as finished as it seems in the end.
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Post #112,247
7/31/03 11:36:07 AM
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We've lost several...
...over this exact issue.
And...as it is said...I am not without sin.
The sad part is I have met many here >In Real Life< and find them all to be people that I would, given proximity and an introduction, be fast friends with. This includes people that I have been "combative" with in these fora.
However, "combative" has occasionally in the past and more often in the present turned to straightforward abuse for no other reason than to be nasty. Intellectual dishonesty from people that I >KNOW< know better.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #112,115
7/30/03 6:20:00 PM
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So long.
Hate to see you go, Chris, but I can relate to where you're coming from, particularly WRT "intellectual snobbery" and the abusive that seems so high of late.
There *is* a lot to be gained here still, especially in the technical arenas. Abrasiveness aside, (and I'll note that what I consider the most abrasive posters are generally absent from the technical fora) there are top-notch people here in nearly every major technical discipline and have always been willing to help.
Also, jabber is fun! ;)
Best of luck, I hope to keep in touch via ubersoft forums in the future.
-----
Steve
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Post #112,121
7/30/03 6:36:45 PM
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This is ironic...
In a very [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=112066|sad] way...
--
Less Is More. In my book, About Face, I introduce over 50 powerful design axioms. This is one of them.
--Alan Cooper. The Inmates Are Running the Asylum
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Post #112,120
7/30/03 6:32:32 PM
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:(
questions, help? [link|mailto:pappas@catholic.org|email pappas at catholic.org]
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Post #112,127
7/30/03 7:19:47 PM
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I'll miss you
you seem to be one of the good ones, I enjoyed reading your posts.
I am sorry that my posts cause others to attack me rather than correct me or stick to the issues. I am working on doing better and I think I made a good post in politics that was well thought out, but I got attacked anyway. These attacks will never drive me away from here, I try my best to ignore them. In my opinion, those attacks are worse than any of my posts ever have been and I seem to be some sort of lightning rod for them.
I post on other forums, and never currently have the problems I have on here. There was issues with Nightowl's Yahoo Group and K5, but they have been worked out. My posts are welcome on the Unemployed IT forums and nobody attacks me there. In fact I have turned K5 around to the point that I am getting 4's and 5's for my posts. I even got Meta-Moderation points on Slashdot. This tells me I am doing better, but for some reason not on here.
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Post #112,244
7/31/03 11:10:21 AM
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Re: I'll miss you
I am sorry that my posts cause others to attack me rather than correct me or stick to the issues. I am working on doing better and I think I made a good post in politics that was well thought out, but I got attacked anyway. These attacks will never drive me away from here, I try my best to ignore them. In my opinion, those attacks are worse than any of my posts ever have been and I seem to be some sort of lightning rod for them.[quote/]
I wanted to point out that after perusing this forum for awhile last night, I went into Politics and read the thread in question with Chris, Orion and etc. I too believe that Orion's post was well thought out and not a bad post whatsoever, so I agree with ChrisR.
I post on other forums, and never currently have the problems I have on here. There was issues with Nightowl's Yahoo Group and K5, but they have been worked out. My posts are welcome on the Unemployed IT forums and nobody attacks me there. In fact I have turned K5 around to the point that I am getting 4's and 5's for my posts. I even got Meta-Moderation points on Slashdot. This tells me I am doing better, but for some reason not on here.
This is true. Orion has been posting some on Port Affinity and with no conflicts whatsoever. One topic got touchy for the other regular poster there, i.e. the Kobe Bryant issue, but when she asked for it to be dropped, it was simply dropped, by both myself and Orion. I applaud that, because it could have morphed, (Drewk's word?) into something much worse. Both my groups have been reduced to very little or no posting based on a conflict borne from the Star Wars group that I was on and banned from, when those few remaining members who were in communicaton with me, finally left, well so did the level of activity. It's a shame that people can't just enjoy one another in all forums, here, or anywhere, without feeling the need to shred one another daily. Nightowl >8# P.S. Thanks for the tips about quoting in the other forum, they work! "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,131
7/30/03 7:48:43 PM
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Yes, the US-world has turned *nasty*. I Wonder Why.
Sorry about your choice - someone once said, "Just give your decisions. Never explain why. You are sure to be misunderstood."
May you discover a little piece of greenery, one immune from the consequences of a culture-at-Large which has decided to suicide.. from the top down. May it be Sunshine every day, and always a cheery note.
Alex Forever!
Ashton
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Post #112,220
7/31/03 9:31:28 AM
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The problem, I think for us lefties is...
we are, perhaps, sometimes too quick to equate optimism with intellectual dishonesty or ignorance.
bcnu,
Mikem
The soul and substance of what customarily ranks as patriotism is moral cowardice and always has been...We have thrown away the most valuable asset we had-- the individual's right to oppose both flag and country when he (just he, by himself) believed them to be in the wrong. We have thrown it away; and with it all that was really respectable about that grotesque and laughable word, Patriotism.
- Mark Twain, "Monarchical and Republican Patriotism"
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Post #112,227
7/31/03 10:01:16 AM
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You woner why?
"Orion: go to your room. Have a cookie".
--
Less Is More. In my book, About Face, I introduce over 50 powerful design axioms. This is one of them.
--Alan Cooper. The Inmates Are Running the Asylum
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Post #112,141
7/30/03 9:16:10 PM
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On going and returning and new topics...
....I do hope you'll return. I like your posts and your strip. I think I understand why you are going.
Like you, I've come to post less and less over time. This is partially because I'm trying to stay employed (doing the work of three; getting the salary of one). But, in addition, there are some subject areas here where I don't feel I can offer much (e.g. no time for flame wars).
It also occurs to me that there are many subject areas that we don't touch on. For example, some technical ones: delivering sub-second response time in a transactional environment; what to do about the hell of integrating buggy .NET components with the rest of the (non-M$) application stack; high availability via application clustering,monitoring tools that actually work, etc. etc.
In short, I wonder if a "topic of the week" forum might not be a good way to re-engage the brain power that exists in this locale. I'm not sure how much of an admin hassle this might be, but it is just a thought. Both technical and non-technical topics could be highlighted. Plausable?
-Slugbug
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Post #112,149
7/30/03 9:42:30 PM
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Buggy .NET components... (new thread)
Created as new thread #112148 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=112148|Buggy .NET components...]
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #112,155
7/30/03 10:14:11 PM
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Startup blues...
I too, am doing the work of three. Less time to post these days.
I get about 10 min a day to read what I can, post what I can. Sometimes, I get 30, when I'm lucky.
In the end, my wife is encouraging me to give up on the forum. She thinks I get better info out of google searches, and I waste my time here.
She thinks, since I work so much, that I already spend too much time on computers at work and I need to focus on RL (Real Life) when I'm at home.
However,
I really respect Greg and Rick Moen in the Linux forum.
Peter is a classic brit. I really like Wade. I've liked Maggie for a long time, but she's more busy than I am (and I'm pretty busy).
Then, there's DeSitter (Ross), whom I respect, and orion, Ray and the rest of the lot, whom I seem to get along with, and every once in a while, get a good chat going.
I feel like I know most of you pretty well. We've been through stuff together, job changes, hacked systems, and such.
So, I think it would be hard for me to give up, because I count at least a few of you as "friends".
Nick was a contributor not too long ago.
I know there's some of the best Linux tech people here, short of those who actually wrote the kernel. (Maybe a few of you have even done that.)
However, I really do think we've kind of become a gated community. I'm concerned as Maggie and a few others are, that this has become a little too personal, and that instead of floating good to great ideas around together, we've just started treating others like "family", and I don't really mean that in a good sense. We've learned to 'dis each other just enough.
Familiarity breeds contempt?
With my wife concerned about my work hours and family time, I've actually thought about leaving the forum, too. But, I will miss most of you, and I try to stay at least minimally involved, when I can.
Glen Austin
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Post #112,186
7/31/03 1:12:57 AM
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Thanks... I think :-)
/me wonders what a "classic Brit" is...
Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #112,240
7/31/03 10:51:24 AM
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Meant as a compliment...
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Post #112,370
8/1/03 1:45:55 AM
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Also thanks.
I know my post volume has gone down in recent months. I've stay mostly out of Politices et al.
Wade.
Is it enough to love
Is it enough to breathe
Somebody rip my heart out
And leave me here to bleed
| |
Is it enough to die
Somebody save my life
I'd rather be Anything but Ordinary
Please
| -- "Anything but Ordinary" by Avril Lavigne. |
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Post #112,380
8/1/03 8:12:06 AM
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I think you've hit on it
Its the friends to family in the "not so good" sense that is happening. And I know I would miss the people here, because they are friends.
I consider everyone here a personal friend. I've had many to the house. I've met many others...including some who are no longer here such as Nick.
Perhaps it has been 8 years of "lightning in a bottle". I prefer to think not...instead thinking that this place is truly an internet miracle...bringing together people that otherwise would have had no chance to meet in order for the friendships to blossom.
I have and will continue to strive to meet as many of you in real life as possible...simply because all of my experience tells me that the experience is worth it.
Enough sap for one morning.
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #112,399
8/1/03 10:29:06 AM
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It's much easier to be offensive to someone you've never met
This is a well-known phenomenon (studies have been done, even. woo.): the anonymity of the Internet breeds contempt. People will say and do things they wouldn't think of saying or doing face to face.
I've made a conscious attempt to filter my online activities with this in mind. I'm not always successful, but I believe I've gotten better.
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #112,401
8/1/03 10:37:13 AM
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Also true
yah bastard! ;-)
If you push something hard enough, it will fall over. Fudd's First Law of Opposition
[link|mailto:bepatient@aol.com|BePatient]
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Post #112,404
8/1/03 10:43:10 AM
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Counter example
**SHUN**
===
Implicitly condoning stupidity since 2001.
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Post #112,158
7/30/03 10:18:02 PM
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Re: On going and returning and new topics...
<slugbug>It also occurs to me that there are many subject areas that we don't touch on. For example, some technical ones: delivering sub-second response time in a transactional environment; what to do about the hell of integrating buggy .NET components with the rest of the (non-M$) application stack; high availability via application clustering,monitoring tools that actually work, etc. etc.
I would like this also. It would encourage me to stay, too.
Monitoring tools that work would be big for me. Buggy .Net components.
Also, I'd like to talk about security, too.
Delivering sub-second resposne time in a transaction environment. Maggie, you and I need to talk sometime. I've done this, at two companies. And I've built lots of systems with 5-30 second response times, too (which did a whole lot more than the subsecond ones did).
Alas, my time is up for tonight and I need to go read to my 3 year old.
Glen Austin
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Post #112,174
7/30/03 11:14:09 PM
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sub-second transactional environments
Glen,
It is possible to deliver sub-second response time in transactional environments and I've done it, too (same as you). But, I'd be interested in discussing:
- what you give up to achieve sub-second response time (compare to 2-5 sec. env.)
- architecting SQL for optimal performance
- how to pinpoint where you are taking the performance hit in distributed apps.
The last point ties into monitoring tools....currently doing a proof of concept with a distributed monitoring tool.
-Slugbug
P.S. Reading to the 3 yr. old is highly worthwhile :-)
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Post #112,226
7/31/03 10:00:32 AM
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Delivering sub-second response times (new thread)
Created as new thread #112225 titled [link|/forums/render/content/show?contentid=112225|Delivering sub-second response times]
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #112,216
7/31/03 9:22:13 AM
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Great idea
That's what we've been missing since the original IWE fora broke down. Without a regular source of new topics, we keep re-hashing the same ones over and over. A few people have taken cracks at starting up regular columns, but they (scratch that, we) have all found out how hard it is to do when you're not getting paid for it.
===
Implicitly condoning stupidity since 2001.
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Post #112,154
7/30/03 10:04:32 PM
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Chris, I'd like to talk you out of it
First, I really dig Ubersoft. Ran into a fan of yours at the last Bay Area Linux Cabal meeting, BTW. \r\n\r\n I realize most fish find me cold, but I honestly shoot for live and let live. There are those here whom I care less about. For the most part, I simply ignore them. On Jabber we've discussed your post, and noted that there's a lot of peace of mind to be had for simply avoiding the Politics, Religion, and War/Conflict forums (not to mention Programming). Programmatically blocking content from a handful of posters also helps my experience considerably. \r\n\r\n I can assure you that you're not who was meant by the "Seagull" posters. \r\n\r\n And while I can't argue for you doing what you need to do for your own mental health, I for one would really miss having you around. --\r\n
Karsten M. Self [link|mailto:kmself@ix.netcom.com|kmself@ix.netcom.com]\r\n
[link|http://kmself.home.netcom.com/|http://kmself.home.netcom.com/]\r\n
What part of "gestalt" don't you understand?\r\n
[link|http://twiki.iwethey.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/|TWikIWETHEY] -- an experiment in collective intelligence. Stupidity. Whatever.\r\n
\r\n
Keep software free. Oppose the CBDTPA. Kill S.2048 dead.\r\n[link|http://www.eff.org/alerts/20020322_eff_cbdtpa_alert.html|http://www.eff.org/alerts/20020322_eff_cbdtpa_alert.html]\r\n
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Post #112,183
7/31/03 12:53:59 AM
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Agreed.
I learned very quickly to stay out of (i.e. - not even read, just mark as read) the Politics and World Conflict forums. Now that I'm working on becoming a bona fide pythonista, the tech fora here are indispensible--not because I couldn't get similar answers on a mailing list, but I get discussion from friends here. That makes all the difference in "new ventures" (with steep learning curves) for me.
So "thank you" semi-specifically (in random order) to: Ben, Scott, Scott, Greg, Karsten, Wade, Peter, Todd, Barry, Ross, Thane, Bill, Bill, ChrisR, Andrew, Steve, and Glen. Plus others, some past tense; I'm sure I've forgotten at least one.
I'm gonna go build my own theme park! With Blackjack! And hookers! In fact, forget the park!
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Post #112,164
7/30/03 10:29:17 PM
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I may have inadvertently contributed to your decision.
And if so, my apologies. I haven't looked, but it seems that we tangled in some discussion (probably politics or regional conflict) that got pretty ugly at one point some time ago.
The thing is, for any liberal mind, the degradation of the Constitution and the mockery we've made of the "shining city on a hill" has caused most of the liberal class to become angry. Very angry and disappointed. It is increasingly difficult for any of us on the Left to hold a civil tongue when we see so little of civility left in our homeland.
I will apologize for offending, but not for being passionate, even shrill, when protesting the demise of a nation that had such great promise.
Best to you and I wish you well.
bcnu,
Mikem
The soul and substance of what customarily ranks as patriotism is moral cowardice and always has been...We have thrown away the most valuable asset we had-- the individual's right to oppose both flag and country when he (just he, by himself) believed them to be in the wrong. We have thrown it away; and with it all that was really respectable about that grotesque and laughable word, Patriotism.
- Mark Twain, "Monarchical and Republican Patriotism"
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Post #112,169
7/30/03 10:46:17 PM
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Re: I may have inadvertently contributed to your decision.
The thing is, for any liberal mind, the degradation of the Constitution and the mockery we've made of the "shining city on a hill" has caused most of the liberal class to become angry. Very angry and disappointed. It is increasingly difficult for any of us on the Left to hold a civil tongue when we see so little of civility left in our homeland. I wish to point out that because of the day's postings, and some discussion with my husband, and consultation of the dictionary, I actually understood the political nature of this post... although I had to stop and think about it. I understood that liberal means democratic, (I found a way to link liberal and conservative to the right places), and that the shining city on a hill is the Capitol in Washington, and that the liberal class is the democratic one, and the Left is also Democratic. (I also found a way to link left wing and right wing to the proper place). So you all haven't failed to educate me completely today. :) Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,212
7/31/03 9:08:59 AM
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Another thing you might find interesting.
Go to [link|http://www.merriam-webster.com|http://www.merriam-webster.com] and look up the word "liberal". The look up its opposite "illiberal". Then try to figure out how "liberal" became a bad word in the US.
bcnu,
Mikem
The soul and substance of what customarily ranks as patriotism is moral cowardice and always has been...We have thrown away the most valuable asset we had-- the individual's right to oppose both flag and country when he (just he, by himself) believed them to be in the wrong. We have thrown it away; and with it all that was really respectable about that grotesque and laughable word, Patriotism.
- Mark Twain, "Monarchical and Republican Patriotism"
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Post #112,165
7/30/03 10:33:07 PM
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And thanks for all the fish?
I have to echo most of what you have said. I haven't completely gone away though. I read from time to time and almost post quite frequently. I have "not sent" more posts (about four to one) in the last few months due to lack of energy and especially time.
Ween yourself off for a while, freshen up, and if you have a change of heart - come on back.
I've quit reading everything but the Mac, Linux, Open and Water Cooler. This place is getting even too cynical for me. I didn't think it was possible, but there you have it.
Tom Petty says, "you need rhino skin if your going to pretend your not hurt by this world..."
Just a few thoughts,
Screamer
But take your time, think a lot,
Why, think of everything you've got.
For you will still be here tomorrow, but your dreams may not.
Y. Islam - Father and Son
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Post #112,170
7/30/03 11:00:02 PM
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Good luck Chris, I'll miss you!
Alex
A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul. -- George Bernard Shaw
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Post #112,171
7/30/03 11:02:39 PM
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Re: So long.
I didn't post a reply here for some time, but I do want to say I'm sorry you feel you have to leave.
I was going to post that I apologize if I had anything to do with it, but I honestly don't think I did, and Scott has been trying to get me not to decide everything is my fault for some time, as has Ben Tilly.
So I'm sorry you are leaving, hope you'll reconsider, and wish you luck.
Nightowl >8#
"I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,187
7/31/03 1:19:13 AM
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Don't be so daft.
I appreciate that I have a distinctly non-fluffy worldview and that I approach this sort of thing with a somewhat different approach to many, but... grow a hide, man!
If you're going to leave because a spiky bastard (i.e. me) is not afraid to complain when something annoys him, or because idiots get called on their idiocy, then that's a sad state of affairs.
The inability for idiocy and morononimity to pass as the norm around here is one of the things I like. Many other web fora and communities are far too interested in looking after the feelings of their members, as if they weren't grown adults, instead of the relentless search for truth and reason (...slightly used) that you get here.
On reflection, ignore the "truth and reason" part, substitute with "sheep".
If you want to ponder "the good old days", go poking around in the archive which Karsten will provide a link to because I can't remember.
It was as shrill and flamey and spiky and EAT ELECTRIC DEATH then as it is now, if not more so.
In summary: stop being such a big girl's blouse.
Peter
[link|http://www.debian.org|Shill For Hire]
[link|http://www.kuro5hin.org|There is no K5 Cabal]
[link|http://guildenstern.dyndns.org|Blog]
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Post #112,198
7/31/03 6:48:15 AM
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Actually - We're all Lumberjacks and we're OK
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Post #112,201
7/31/03 7:14:02 AM
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I believe I understand what you are saying.
I had written a long response but then on reflection decided that it would not change anything.
It is a bit difficult being outside the US today & trying to talk to people in the US on certain topics. Common sense says that at times of 'extreme' nationalism, join in or bail out.
Sadly there are many here who do have a worldy wisdom & insight beyond crass political jihadism but it seems they may be in a minority.
Doug.
Perhaps one day,
if the world adjusts to the 'new order'
(or the 'new order' gets adjusted)
We may find that place inthe sun where we could thrash out intelligent issues with intelligent debate (and the occasional technology jihad :-)
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Post #112,205
7/31/03 8:22:23 AM
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I wish you well
What you are saying rings true.
"I disagree with you and here's why"
morphed into something else some time ago.
Best of luck whereever your browser lands you.
-Mike
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.
Andre Gide (1869 - 1951)
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Post #112,217
7/31/03 9:24:07 AM
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Here's when
"I disagree with you and here's why"
morphed into something else some time ago. It was when each participant decided that they had reached their personal conclusion to each perpetual argument. We've been talking about the same things with the same people for far too long. Now even on the rare occasions when we get fresh blood, the regulars dump on him with conclusions rather than conversation. We need to find something else to talk about. ===
Implicitly condoning stupidity since 2001.
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Post #112,243
7/31/03 11:00:11 AM
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Think you're right
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.
Andre Gide (1869 - 1951)
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Post #112,259
7/31/03 1:35:17 PM
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At the beginning . .
. . I and others predicted this would happen - if there wasn't a continuous feed, as there was from InfoWorld, of new persons and new topics. How this can be emulated is a difficult problem, but it must be solved or IWeThey will fade into irrelevence.
That time is not so far away. For one thing, I have noticed a continuous decline in traffic volume in Area 51, replaced by continuous heavy traffic for pissing matches in the non-technical sections. This accelerated after 9/11.
I find it very easy to ignore the "Topical" section entirely, since the noise level is very high there, and the signal rather weak.
[link|http://www.aaxnet.com|AAx]
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Post #112,294
7/31/03 4:57:40 PM
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I tried to jumpstart topics
by picking news items links and posting them to the forums to try and get new threads started, but now that it is considered "Seagull Posting" I cannot do that anymore.
Infoworld has regular reporters who come up with new topics each month or so, we don't seem to have that here. But I must say the forum software here is far superior to any other forum I know of.
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Post #112,295
7/31/03 4:59:59 PM
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Re: I tried to jumpstart topics
But I must say the forum software here is far superior to any other forum I know of. I must agree there. I think this is the best forum I've ever tried to be on. The Affinity ones were almost impossible for me to navigate, and I still can't figure out much of the site that the Yo-Da order made me a moderator of! I agree with whoever it was, (was it several?) that said we need some new things to talk about... any ideas anyone? Nightowl >8# "I learned to be the door, instead of the mat!" "illegitimi nil carborundum" (Don't let the bastards grind you down)
Comment by Nightowl
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Post #112,296
7/31/03 5:03:28 PM
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Don't worry about it.
I've found several of the articles you've posted to be quite informative.
"seagull posts" to me are drop-in "me too" or utterly, inanely obvious posts. Not article links.
Regards,
-scott anderson
"Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson..."
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Post #112,215
7/31/03 9:21:01 AM
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You'll be missed
Come back in a few months. Maybe it won't bother you as much.
-----------------------------------------
[link|http://www.talion.com/questionw.html|?W]
Where were you in 72?
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Post #112,231
7/31/03 10:06:41 AM
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Re: So long.
Honor to those who in the life they lead
define and guard a Thermopylae.
Never betraying what is right,
consistent and just in all they do
but showing pity also, and compassion;
generous when they're rich, and when they're poor,
still generous in small ways,
still helping as much as they can;
always speaking the truth,
yet without hating those who lie.
And even more honor is due to them
when they foresee (as many do foresee)
that Ephialtis will turn up in the end,
that the Medes will break through after all.
C.P.Cavafy
Goodbye, Chris. We will miss you.
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Post #112,267
7/31/03 1:58:26 PM
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Good luck with Nifty Doorways 6.0
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Post #112,309
7/31/03 6:19:23 PM
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For what it's worth...
...I agree witht he numerous posters who have said:
1) Take a break, refresh, and when you are ready, rejoin
2) We'll miss you. any reduction in the "gene pool" here hurts us all.
3) Love the strip.
Looking forward to your eventual return..........
jb4
The difference between Confidence and Ego is that Confidence has respect, while Ego does not.
Candyce Burns (my wife)
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